New Roadster

[eaglewolf]

Hello to everyone. I joined this forum a while ago and used it more for research as I didn't feel I could contribute since I didn't own a Mesa yet. I've been lurking around reading various posts while I decided what I wanted to replace my Marshall MG100 amp for my Les Paul.

Today I went to my local Mesa dealer (GC in this area) and took care of that problem. I came home with the Roadster and a 2X12 cabinet. I didn't want anything huge, and they didn't have the combo version I was looking for. (Well they did but couldn't get it to work as it had some problem they couldn't resolve.) I compared this amp to the Marshall 410H and 2X12 cabinet, but I just preferred the sound of the Mesa. The Marshall sounded great, but I felt I could do more with the Roadster, something I'm sure is common knowledge around here.

I had a PRS Custom 24 that was stolen - I may get that back since it was recovered, but I have to work it out with the insurance company - and I'm told they seem to be a great match with the Mesa amps. As it is, I preferred it with my current LP as well. I'm seeing why people are so pleased with these amps.

I must say that the videos they had on the Mesa website helped me with my decision. I was more thinking Marshall, but what I saw and heard caused me to check out the Mesa gear as well. The guy on the lead page of the Mesa website - Andy Timmons, someone I had never heard of before - was incredible. I ended up downloading two of his albums from iTunes right after listening to Resolution. I wonder how I missed this guy! Hearing the different tones and styles of music Mesa worked well with made me want to check them out. I am glad I did.

Hopefully I'll be around here more frequently to learn about this new amp, besides from playing it of course. Thanks in advance for what I will gain from here, and thanks for the input you unknowingly gave me already.

David

 

[domct203]

Congrats on the new Roadster. It's a great amp with alot of features that need time to really get to know.

Dom

 

[eaglewolf]

Thanks. I'm looking forward to becoming familiar with this amp. It impressed me from the start, so I suspect it will only get better as I learn what makes it tick. In any case, I'm tickled pink over this one.

David

 

[Griz]

No doubt, congrats on the Roadster! You're going to have a lot of fun digging into one of the ultimate Boogies. Welcome to the site as well. Keep us posted!

 

[andrewstcyr]

The roadster definitely takes some time to dial in but once you get familiar with all the settings it will really grow on you!

 

[eaglewolf]

I haven't had a lot of time to dial this amp in, as this is finals week coming up (I'm finishing an Electrical Engineering degree later in life - I'm 47) but I've noticed that the amp sounds a bit dark (trebble suppressed) in this setup. My thought is that when I tried it out at the store, the 2X12 was sitting on top of a 4X12 cabinet, even though the 4X12 wasn't hooked in. At home I have the 2X12 sitting on the floor, meaning that the speakers are not at ear level for where I have been sitting while playing. Here the speakers are facing the same direction as I am, rather than towards me. Sound being what it is, it can be rather picky about setup at times if you are not really cranking it.

Maybe I just need to add the 4X12 to bring the speakers up to ear level. Other than the fact that my wife would kill me if I did...

Seriously, the amp head is the same one I used at the store, though the 2X12 was not (they grabbed one still in the box.) I'm just curious as to if I'm on the right track - setup - or there might be something else. I've played with the tone controls to fix it, but it doesn't seem right yet. The Marshall MG100 didn't seem to have the same issue in the same location. (That's not an endorsement for the MG, by the way.)

Understand that I'm not dissatisfied with the amp at all, but am getting used to it at the moment. I just notice a difference between what I'm hearing at home and what I heard at the store.

Any thoughts?

David

 

[Areola]

having the high ends shoot at your ears is important. especially if you plan on micing up the amp, cause that's the tone the mic will pick up.

 

[TheBlackman]

I know exactly what you mean, i had the combo and you pretty much have to be directly infront to get the high-end, for a while the band was saying it sounded harsh but it sounded great from where i stood. i just upgraded to the head and a 4x12 (plus i use the 2x12 at practice) and am getting a great sound. the closed back cabinets are very 1-directional. on a side note, the other guitarist uses a mg100 full stack at practice and the roadster with the 2x12 kills it, can't wait to gig the half-stack!

 

[jdurso]

I haven't had a lot of time to dial this amp in, as this is finals week coming up (I'm finishing an Electrical Engineering degree later in life - I'm 47) but I've noticed that the amp sounds a bit dark (trebble suppressed) in this setup. My thought is that when I tried it out at the store, the 2X12 was sitting on top of a 4X12 cabinet, even though the 4X12 wasn't hooked in. At home I have the 2X12 sitting on the floor, meaning that the speakers are not at ear level for where I have been sitting while playing. Here the speakers are facing the same direction as I am, rather than towards me. Sound being what it is, it can be rather picky about setup at times if you are not really cranking it.

Maybe I just need to add the 4X12 to bring the speakers up to ear level. Other than the fact that my wife would kill me if I did...

Seriously, the amp head is the same one I used at the store, though the 2X12 was not (they grabbed one still in the box.) I'm just curious as to if I'm on the right track - setup - or there might be something else. I've played with the tone controls to fix it, but it doesn't seem right yet. The Marshall MG100 didn't seem to have the same issue in the same location. (That's not an endorsement for the MG, by the way.)

Understand that I'm not dissatisfied with the amp at all, but am getting used to it at the moment. I just notice a difference between what I'm hearing at home and what I heard at the store.

Any thoughts?

David

First off most Rectos in general are darker amps and the Roadster is on the darker scale of all the Rectos right along side the tremoverb (IMO). So off the bat its a darker amp than your probably used to.

What kind of cabinet is it? The cabinet you use dictates a lot in your tone. Speaker configs as well as cabinet design can be the difference between being too dark, too bright or just right. For instance i have found my Roadster sounds a lot brighter playing just through my Basson 2x12 and sounds somewhat darker when playing just through my Roadster 2x12 cab. This is the reason i mix the two together and I end up with a very balanced tone.

Even with a high end quality cabinet, if it doesnt match the type of tone your going for its reduced to a very expensive box. Just out of curiosity what kind of overall tone are you going for? Since you just got this setup it may not be a bad idea to return the cab for something else thats a better fit.... thats if you feel another cab gets you the tone your after.

Other suggestions would be a graphic EQ in the loop. Most of us recto users gravitate towards through an eq of some sort in the loop because of various reasons. One reason is to fine tune your tone by making slight adjustments, bringing out or suppressing certain frequencies. It works like a charm and IMO should be something thats built into the amp much like the Mark IV.

Last question would be, where are your mids? The reason i ask is because most people tend to scoop the mids because they come from amps with stronger mids. The Rectos are naturally scooped so further scooping them can actually kill some of the sweet high end that can make the amp sing... i suggest always keeping the mids between 11 and 1 depending on what type of tone your after.

 

[Loser No. 27]

I'd also keep in mind that the acoustics in your home are likely far different than that of the shop which is going to be a factor in why you're not getting that same sound. Is the area where you have the amp placed carpeted? Any cloth covered furniture directly across from it? I'd perhaps try placing the amp in different spots and see if you can't get a better sound. If elevating the amp and cab itself isn't an option, try tilting the cab back a bit so the speakers fire more upward.

I had a similar experience when I brought my Roadster combo home. I live in an old basement apartment where the concrete floor under the carpet is VERY uneven. I couldn't figure out why I was getting such a crappy sound out of my Roadster in there until a friend pointed out to me the amp was actually leaning so far forward due to the uneven floor...it was basically firing downward and directly into the carpet. A few location changes around the room and I was able to get it sounding great.

 

[Old BF Shred]

Congrats on the new amp, EW.

The comments here are pretty much spot on. A closed back cab (2-12 or 4-12) is quite directional. Personally I don't care for the sound right in front, but that's my preference.

An open back, like the combo will sound a little more open and less directional, but you will lose low end as well.....everything is a trade off to some extent.

Since you bought at GC, you, of course have 30 days to change your mind, but I would not be too quick to return it just yet. Mesa amps are "notorious" for versatility.
I use this term because it's a curse and blessing all in one. Their amps (I own 4) have always been sensitive to control set up changes. It WILL take a while to find your favorite settings/tone. Any model Mesa poses this challenge.
But once you find it......... !!!

So spend some time with it (like you wouldn't with a new amp, anyway :lol: ) and be sure you try several settings before making a decision.

You still have that 30 day option, in case.......
Good luck

 

[Robusto]

Congrats on the new Roadster.

I agree with the above posts...(and what cab do you have).

Two things with dialing in 'your tone'.

1. This thread and the resultant bypass of the fx loop was key:

http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=29062

It really opens up the amp (I think you will find it far less 'dark').

2. Read the manual, and have a couple (or more) tone tweaking sessions. The controls on the Roadster are very sensative and even small changes can make a difference. Then read the manual again. It is packed with very good info.

Congrats again, and Welcome.

 

[jdurso]

2. Read the manual, and have a couple (or more) tone tweaking sessions. The controls on the Roadster are very sensative and even small changes can make a difference. Then read the manual again. It is packed with very good info.

Great point... especially if your coming from marshall-land, know how all the preamp eqs work is crucial to getting the sound you want. Since they're very active and work together rather then seperate, some people tend to through the eqs they're used to with different amps and end up not liking the results.

Also a great way to get started with tweaking is using the Factory settings in the manual. Find a few that get you close to where you wnat and make minor tweaks from there.

 

[Stratocaster]

Eaglewolf, congrats on the Roadster.

I agree with the others regarding placing the 2x12 on the floor….it will provide a different tone then sitting up off the ground. I use a stand with my 2x12 for this reason.

I also agree regarding the Mesa’s dial-in process. It can take awhile sometimes. I know you have a lot on your plate with learning the amp (review the manual about once a month for a good bit of time) in addition to your pursuit of higher education. Let me tell you about something that can be a huge timesaver…


I normally don’t share this, but if I’m not going to tell my brethren on the Boogie Board, who would I tell? Let technology be your friend…

If you have a pedal with a looping function, it can be a huge benefit for dialing in a tone. It doesn’t have to be a dedicated looper…I use my Boss DD-7 ($159.99 at GC), as it has up to 40 seconds of loop time. Go from guitar into the pedal, then directly into the amp. Play the riff/lead that you want, letting the looper grab it. I normally change between my neck and bridge pickup about halfway through the recording, because I like setups sounding acceptable on all pickups that I commonly use.

Play the loop, turn the volume down on your guitar and put it on the stand. Now start chasing the tone. You can easily change Channels, Modes, and any other settings you feel like. You can walk around the room. You can get another beer. You’re not hearing it while playing, you’re in the audience. It's like dialing in a radio station at this point.

Edit: If you use a looper as directed above, just be sure the output of the looper is the equivalent volume as the 'direct' sound. Example - on the DD-7, having the 'E. Level' control set to 3:00 will play back the loop at the same level as the direct sound. Anything above 3:00, and the loop would actually be played back 'louder' then the direct sound. Of course, this will vary by looper and should be covered in the pedal's manual.


Once you get it in the right ballpark, kill the loop and pick the guitar up again. You may want to loop it again at this point, or you may just go to the fine tuning. If you wish, remove the looper from the signal chain; throw any remaining items into your signal chain, or whatever you need to do. The functional thing to remember is that the looper needs to be in front of the preamp.


Strat

 

[CoG]

I normally don’t share this, but if I’m not going to tell my brethren on the Boogie Board, who would I tell? Let technology be your friend…

If you have a pedal with a looping function, it can be a huge benefit for dialing in a tone.

Strat

hahaha OMG I can't believe I never thought of this... brilliant :shock: :lol:

 

[Freefall]

If you have a pedal with a looping function, it can be a huge benefit for dialing in a tone.

Using a looper is a really great idea.

As it happens, I just returned a Roadster half stack. It sounded amazing in the shop, but at practice I just couldn't reproduce the vibe; it wouldn't cut through at all. I suspect the great tone I heard in the shop was somewhere in that amp, but after a few practices with it, I couldn't find it and I decided to return it before the 30 days was up. Thirty days is nice, but for an amp that requires a lot of tweaking, sometimes even that's not enough time. Maybe if I'd thought of Strat's trick, I'd have been able to dial it in. Oh well, for now it's back to my VH4.

 

[CoG]

It took my bandmate and I eight months of about half and hour of fiddling once or twice a week before every practice to really dial in all four channels. Sounds amazing now, it's actually an 8-channel amp with volume matching across all 8 channels... using a boost in front sometimes and an EQ in the loop for modern. Main thing is you have to play LOUD, and whack the front end pretty hard in ch3 or 4 if you want to cut. You can also try making the EL34 tradeoff where you get incredible highgain tones and kind of eh, whatever clean tones.

Also, yeah, closed-back Mesas are incredibly directional. Basically unless you are right in front of it or more than 18-20 feet away you aren't actually hearing it.

 

[eaglewolf]

Thanks for all the replies! I was surprised at them all when I got back to checking the board.

I bought a Mesa 2X12 cabinet - if there is more than one I'm not sure which it is. Since I'm not at home at the moment I can't check, so that will have to wait. I assumed that it was the same model as what I was using when I tried out the head, but that might be presumptuous.

As for taking it back, I was impressed enough at the store with this amp that I don't plan on getting rid of it. Being very familiar with stereo equipment (I'm using B&W Nautilus 804's in my system) I'm quite familiar with speaker placement, but I just wasn't expecting it from the guitar amplifier. Well, duh! I'll have to look at how I can improve that. Maybe a 4X12 is in order... you know, just to prop up the 2X12... dear, you understand, right? I'll just have to become a member of Tweakers Anonymous and get this amp dialed in right. The salesman did mention that about the Mesa amps, as he said it was the one thing that he didn't like about Mesa products (he was a Marshall guy himself) preferring a more defined sound. I wanted more versatility and the clean sounds the Roadster offered.

I appreciate all the suggestions. As for what tone I'm looking for, I'm still working on that. I like my clean sound to really sound clean, which is part of why I chose the Mesa over the Marshall. I liked the different settings on the Mesa (Raw, Vintage, Modern) and the distorted sounds they gave. I enjoy a variety of music and styles, being that I'm not writing my own stuff at this point. AC/DC, Guns and Roses, Van Halen, Led Zeppelin, Journey, Earl Klugh, SRV, Satriani, Eric Johnson, Eric Clapton, Bruce Springsteen, John Mellencamp etc. are all groups whose sound I enjoy. I also like CCR, the Who, Hendrix, George Thorogood, and a variety of other groups that is probably really dating me! I'll settle in with what works best for me, but it just will take me some time to determine that.

David

 

[paytojt]

Thanks for all the replies! I was surprised at them all when I got back to checking the board.

I bought a Mesa 2X12 cabinet - if there is more than one I'm not sure which it is. Since I'm not at home at the moment I can't check, so that will have to wait. I assumed that it was the same model as what I was using when I tried out the head, but that might be presumptuous.

As for taking it back, I was impressed enough at the store with this amp that I don't plan on getting rid of it. Being very familiar with stereo equipment (I'm using B&W Nautilus 804's in my system) I'm quite familiar with speaker placement, but I just wasn't expecting it from the guitar amplifier. Well, duh! I'll have to look at how I can improve that. Maybe a 4X12 is in order... you know, just to prop up the 2X12... dear, you understand, right? I'll just have to become a member of Tweakers Anonymous and get this amp dialed in right. The salesman did mention that about the Mesa amps, as he said it was the one thing that he didn't like about Mesa products (he was a Marshall guy himself) preferring a more defined sound. I wanted more versatility and the clean sounds the Roadster offered.

I appreciate all the suggestions. As for what tone I'm looking for, I'm still working on that. I like my clean sound to really sound clean, which is part of why I chose the Mesa over the Marshall. I liked the different settings on the Mesa (Raw, Vintage, Modern) and the distorted sounds they gave. I enjoy a variety of music and styles, being that I'm not writing my own stuff at this point. AC/DC, Guns and Roses, Van Halen, Led Zeppelin, Journey, Earl Klugh, SRV, Satriani, Eric Johnson, Eric Clapton, Bruce Springsteen, John Mellencamp etc. are all groups whose sound I enjoy. I also like CCR, the Who, Hendrix, George Thorogood, and a variety of other groups that is probably really dating me! I'll settle in with what works best for me, but it just will take me some time to determine that.

David

Have you checked out the Stiletto? It sounds more in tune with all those bands you mentioned. Definitely cuts as well. Just a thought, especially since you have the luxury of returning it. Otherwise, try JJ KT77 tubes on EL34 bias. You get the best qualities of 6L6 and EL 34 in the same tube, and you keep great cleans.

 

[Mark Fore]

Buy a Soldano SLO and call it a day. If that amp won't make you happy (based on the bands you listed) nothing will.