Help - Rectifier Cab mic setup
- Thread starter James18
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try to record the slaveout direct with your multitrack / daw and use a convolution-reverb with an imupse/response of a mesa 4x12 cab. (can get a free demo at www.recabi.net)
it´s much easier and you have more options at the and.
this may not be the answere you wanted to have, but it will give you alot more options to tweak your sound as just using a SM58.
it´s much easier and you have more options at the and.
this may not be the answere you wanted to have, but it will give you alot more options to tweak your sound as just using a SM58.
MusicManJP6
Well-known member
I believe John Petrucci likes to close mic on axis halfway between the cone and the surround. The middle is too bright and the edge usually too muddy - in the middle is a good mix of highs and lows. I've even read that he covers his cabs with a thick blanket to control the room ambience, mic bleed, and volume.
HTH!
HTH!
JF Omalycat
Well-known member
Everything MusicMan said...
If I were you, I'd try taking the top capsule of the 58 and see what happens, it's just a 57 on the inside.
One other thing I'd suggest (I'm no expert) would be recording two tracks. Maybe on mic'd and one with the slave out? Could be good...
Best of luck.
If I were you, I'd try taking the top capsule of the 58 and see what happens, it's just a 57 on the inside.
One other thing I'd suggest (I'm no expert) would be recording two tracks. Maybe on mic'd and one with the slave out? Could be good...
Best of luck.
bloodspoint
Well-known member
The suggestion to try a mix of direct an mic'ed is good one, as is taking the head shell off the 58. They do have a different frequency response from the 57, due almost entirely to the head shell. And as others have said, I usually find a sweet spot somewhere in the span of the cone, rather than dead center.
The other thing to consider is that you're recording the guitar to sound good in the mix, not by itself. On its own you may find that that guitar sounds too bright and not full enough to you, but pop in the rest of the mix, and it sounds just right, whereas a guitar that sounds full and not too bright on its own gets lost in the mix, and/or walks on some of the other instruments.
Multi-tracking is key to a full sound, as well. Some people like to record 6 or more tracks. I always go with two to start, and then add more if it sounds like it's needed.
The other thing to consider is that you're recording the guitar to sound good in the mix, not by itself. On its own you may find that that guitar sounds too bright and not full enough to you, but pop in the rest of the mix, and it sounds just right, whereas a guitar that sounds full and not too bright on its own gets lost in the mix, and/or walks on some of the other instruments.
Multi-tracking is key to a full sound, as well. Some people like to record 6 or more tracks. I always go with two to start, and then add more if it sounds like it's needed.
MusicManJP6
Well-known member
Yeah, definitely double track as well. Try the same settings and mic placement with two takes - one panned left and the other panned right. Add some bass and drums and see how you like it!
JF Omalycat
Well-known member
Oh, and once again, I'm not an expert, but I've had better luck recording "heavy" sounds with the gain substanstially lower than I would play live. I have found this even more true with Rectos. (and Fender Devilles 
) Seems to help getting rid of that whole "beehive" effect and gives the recording a little more punch.
Just my opinion, of course. I'm one of those idiots that can screw around with mic placements for hours and never get bored....
) Seems to help getting rid of that whole "beehive" effect and gives the recording a little more punch. Just my opinion, of course. I'm one of those idiots that can screw around with mic placements for hours and never get bored....
Chris McKinley
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Some really good advice so far. I'd tell you to do it the hard way and spend the time tweaking the mic placement. The best producers I've known for getting heavy guitar sounds have in common that they all spend seriously silly amounts of time tweaking just the right mic placement, angle, etc. I always work with a partner, having him hit chords, lead runs and harmonics while I tweak the mic, then run back and do a listen.
If you have the option, once you've found a mic placement you like, mark the exact spot on the floor and on the cab's grill where you are pointing the center of the mic. I use colored bookmark tape because it's thin, brightly colored and comes off without harming anything. Also write down the exact angle of the mic (as much as possible), both horizontal and vertical.
As to multiple tracking, I like to use three different mic placements, with an optional fourth. Mic 1 is placed 2-3 inches away from the speaker, on-axis, about midway from cone to edge. Mic 2 is placed 2-3 inches away from a different speaker, off-axis, with the mic pointing toward a spot about 2/3 the way from cone to edge with the bottom of the mic angling away from the cab about 45 degrees.
Mic 3 is a room mic placed about 4 to 5 feet high and about 10-12 feet away from the cab. At what angle the mic stand is placed in relation to the cab is a matter of tweaking. Same with the angle of the mic on the stand. This is due to the individual phase problems that are unique to every recording environment as well as finding just the right tone. This mic's placement has to be tweaked while also listening to the other two mics so as to avoid phase noise.
If the guitarist is using an open-backed cab or combo, I use an additional mic. Mic 4 is a flat electret condenser mic that is placed inside the cab if it is open-backed, usually taped upside down against the top of the cab. This mic can capture both a different emphasis of bass tones and can actually thicken up the whole signal by capturing sound waves that are slightly out of phase with the ones captured by the mics on the front of the speakers.
All of this requires serious tweaking, but once you've got it just right, it will yield a much bigger guitar sound per track than simply doing multiple tracks off of the same mic in front of the speaker. You get a wide, full range of frequency response from top to bottom, and you can blend in just the right amount of ambient sound, and that's per track. All four mics can be blended to create a single guitar track. Now when you double it, the guitar begins to sound huge. This is exactly the process I used in producing my latest client who wanted a sound similar to Alter Bridge and Disturbed.
None of this would be possible, though, without developing an ear for tweaking mics. Even if you use DAW's (which I do occasionally), training your ear is still invaluable for getting the best recordings possible.
If you have the option, once you've found a mic placement you like, mark the exact spot on the floor and on the cab's grill where you are pointing the center of the mic. I use colored bookmark tape because it's thin, brightly colored and comes off without harming anything. Also write down the exact angle of the mic (as much as possible), both horizontal and vertical.
As to multiple tracking, I like to use three different mic placements, with an optional fourth. Mic 1 is placed 2-3 inches away from the speaker, on-axis, about midway from cone to edge. Mic 2 is placed 2-3 inches away from a different speaker, off-axis, with the mic pointing toward a spot about 2/3 the way from cone to edge with the bottom of the mic angling away from the cab about 45 degrees.
Mic 3 is a room mic placed about 4 to 5 feet high and about 10-12 feet away from the cab. At what angle the mic stand is placed in relation to the cab is a matter of tweaking. Same with the angle of the mic on the stand. This is due to the individual phase problems that are unique to every recording environment as well as finding just the right tone. This mic's placement has to be tweaked while also listening to the other two mics so as to avoid phase noise.
If the guitarist is using an open-backed cab or combo, I use an additional mic. Mic 4 is a flat electret condenser mic that is placed inside the cab if it is open-backed, usually taped upside down against the top of the cab. This mic can capture both a different emphasis of bass tones and can actually thicken up the whole signal by capturing sound waves that are slightly out of phase with the ones captured by the mics on the front of the speakers.
All of this requires serious tweaking, but once you've got it just right, it will yield a much bigger guitar sound per track than simply doing multiple tracks off of the same mic in front of the speaker. You get a wide, full range of frequency response from top to bottom, and you can blend in just the right amount of ambient sound, and that's per track. All four mics can be blended to create a single guitar track. Now when you double it, the guitar begins to sound huge. This is exactly the process I used in producing my latest client who wanted a sound similar to Alter Bridge and Disturbed.
None of this would be possible, though, without developing an ear for tweaking mics. Even if you use DAW's (which I do occasionally), training your ear is still invaluable for getting the best recordings possible.
Silverwulf
Well-known member
Chris McKinley said:
Some good advice here. I like to mark it off and then just take a quick pic for reference. With digital cameras, it's easy to keep a log of how you did things these days and store it for future reference. Just double check once you've marked it off since adding tape to the grill could potentially affect the sound in a way you don't like.
For marking off the cab, I've used masking tape in the past since it comes off easy. In fact, I still have masking tape on the grill of my Mesa 4X12 from a year ago. Been using it as a reference for engineers live. Figured I already found a sweet spot I liked, why leave it up to chance? What I'm considering doing is getting one of those newer Audix Cab Grabber's and bringing my own 57 with me to shows. Just mic up the cab myself in a spot I know I like since it would take no time (with the cab still marked off) and all the engineer would need to do is plug in.
Areola
Well-known member
wow... great advice.
I'd like to say a +1 to the following...
Mark the spot which is halfway between the cone and the surround...
make the room as dead as possible. dead sounds work better for heavy guitars...
sm57 is probably the best mic for guitars, so remove that cap...
make sure its mixed to truly know if its sounding good.
I had some background noise on my guitar recording one time, double tracked it, and added bass and it sounded pretty damned good. I'd equate it to the recording quality of Soundgarden's Badmotorfinger (which for a major label release is riddled with hiss and background noise) and I did this in my bedroom.
I'd like to say a +1 to the following...
Mark the spot which is halfway between the cone and the surround...
make the room as dead as possible. dead sounds work better for heavy guitars...
sm57 is probably the best mic for guitars, so remove that cap...
make sure its mixed to truly know if its sounding good.
I had some background noise on my guitar recording one time, double tracked it, and added bass and it sounded pretty damned good. I'd equate it to the recording quality of Soundgarden's Badmotorfinger (which for a major label release is riddled with hiss and background noise) and I did this in my bedroom.
