mental projection said:Hi, I love Diezel amps and I want to buy one in the future, but now I've a Mesa Dual Rectifier, but I'm not really satisfied by the sound and the definition. Could you give me some advise to obtain a Tool like sound? Thanks a lot.
TheMagicEight said:Well, I took another trip today; went out to a store that had Diezel, Bogner, Engl, Fryette, etc. Now I just got the Mark V, but not wanting to drop $2k on the amp without searching around a bit, I decided to check out the company that I can't seem to get out of my head: Diezel. I've heard over and over about how these Diezel owners get their amps and slowly sell off everything else they've owned, and I'm dying to know why.
So I talk to one of the reps and ask him if he wouldn't mind giving me a little demo of the VH4, since he said he owned one. He plays through a Les Paul and proceeds to run me through each of the channels, going through different styles of how he might set them up. The first thing I noticed is that the channels are voiced very similarly - good and bad in my eyes. Great because you won't ever need to worry about checking back and forth to make sure something still sounds good compared to the other channels - like on the Mark or on my XTC - but bad because the amp will always sound like itself. Put another way, I can pull off a pretty **** good JCM800 impression on my Recto with some radical settings on the orange channel, then get to the classic Recto crunch on the Red.
Moving forward, I asked about the tone stack. On the Diezel, it's after the gain stages so you don't need to worry about killing all definition if you decide to turn treble down. If you do this on the Mesa amps - at least the ones I've played - you'll quickly learn to not do it again. Now if you're unfamiliar with the VH4, there's a Bass, Mid and Treble control for each channel - along with gain and volume - and a global Presence and Deep. Because of the layout, you'd need to work pretty hard to make the Diezel sound bad. Basically, the configuration would be like taking away the preamp controls from a Mark and using the 5 band to control what you hear. The 5 band may change the way it sounds, but the way I see it, the overall "tone" won't be affected much unless you use radical settings.
I view this as very limiting in some cases, though it does make for simplicity. The negative aspect of it is that you can't make the amp respond to your playing in too much of a different manner. Sure, the power amp will eventually determine the feel, but you need to get volumes up pretty high before that happens. This is in contrast to the Mesa, where Treble, Mid and Bass can radically alter the feel of the amp because the stack comes before the gains stages. Case in point, if you want to give a Recto more bite, turn the treble up. If you want more bite out of the Diezel, sell it and buy something else! :lol:
What I couldn't get away from on the Diezel - and I believe this aspect felt better playing than it sounded - was the way the preamp responded. Others have said it and I will agree that it doesn't play like others. The notes are cut off quickly; what you play is what comes out of the amp. I again see this as good and bad. It's really refreshing to not have the sag - some will call it "character" - of the amp. You can play something and it will come out with a level of precision unmatched by anything else. It's bad because it can feel like it has no body, even if you do turn up bass and deep. Plug into a vintage Marshall and you do not get precision, especially if it's cranked like it should be. The life of the amp takes over though and that's what matters. I'd bet with the Diezel they cranked mids into the preamp, then tamed them before the tone stack. This effect should be what makes for such a great cutoff, though it makes higher notes - anything on the D string - sound a little weird when palm muted.
As for my assessment, I did like the Diezel quite a bit! I found it to be capable of doing a lot more than I expected and anyone who views it as a one or two trick pony is sorely misguided. Again, it was so very nice to be able to take the tone stack at face value and not have to think about how each will affect the amp's playability. However, although it can sound like many things, it will always feel like the same VH4 - something which I, as a person who enjoys a bit of variety in the feel of the instrument, would not appreciate if it were the only amp I owned.
At this point in time - I'm a 19 year old in college - I wouldn't drop $4k on it. If it blew me away, I'd have a tough time deciding between it and the Mark V, but the V has so much more to offer in the feel of the amp, where the Diezel seems to only change what it sounds like. I'd love to own one down the line because they're really cool amps and when you need something that's just simple, they'd be great to turn to. But with that said, I can only afford to own so much and the VH4 will have to wait.
If anyone else has experience with Diezel amps, I'd love to hear what you found and what you liked and disliked.
candletears7 said:TheMagicEight said:Well, I took another trip today; went out to a store that had Diezel, Bogner, Engl, Fryette, etc. Now I just got the Mark V, but not wanting to drop $2k on the amp without searching around a bit, I decided to check out the company that I can't seem to get out of my head: Diezel. I've heard over and over about how these Diezel owners get their amps and slowly sell off everything else they've owned, and I'm dying to know why.
So I talk to one of the reps and ask him if he wouldn't mind giving me a little demo of the VH4, since he said he owned one. He plays through a Les Paul and proceeds to run me through each of the channels, going through different styles of how he might set them up. The first thing I noticed is that the channels are voiced very similarly - good and bad in my eyes. Great because you won't ever need to worry about checking back and forth to make sure something still sounds good compared to the other channels - like on the Mark or on my XTC - but bad because the amp will always sound like itself. Put another way, I can pull off a pretty **** good JCM800 impression on my Recto with some radical settings on the orange channel, then get to the classic Recto crunch on the Red.
Moving forward, I asked about the tone stack. On the Diezel, it's after the gain stages so you don't need to worry about killing all definition if you decide to turn treble down. If you do this on the Mesa amps - at least the ones I've played - you'll quickly learn to not do it again. Now if you're unfamiliar with the VH4, there's a Bass, Mid and Treble control for each channel - along with gain and volume - and a global Presence and Deep. Because of the layout, you'd need to work pretty hard to make the Diezel sound bad. Basically, the configuration would be like taking away the preamp controls from a Mark and using the 5 band to control what you hear. The 5 band may change the way it sounds, but the way I see it, the overall "tone" won't be affected much unless you use radical settings.
I view this as very limiting in some cases, though it does make for simplicity. The negative aspect of it is that you can't make the amp respond to your playing in too much of a different manner. Sure, the power amp will eventually determine the feel, but you need to get volumes up pretty high before that happens. This is in contrast to the Mesa, where Treble, Mid and Bass can radically alter the feel of the amp because the stack comes before the gains stages. Case in point, if you want to give a Recto more bite, turn the treble up. If you want more bite out of the Diezel, sell it and buy something else! :lol:
What I couldn't get away from on the Diezel - and I believe this aspect felt better playing than it sounded - was the way the preamp responded. Others have said it and I will agree that it doesn't play like others. The notes are cut off quickly; what you play is what comes out of the amp. I again see this as good and bad. It's really refreshing to not have the sag - some will call it "character" - of the amp. You can play something and it will come out with a level of precision unmatched by anything else. It's bad because it can feel like it has no body, even if you do turn up bass and deep. Plug into a vintage Marshall and you do not get precision, especially if it's cranked like it should be. The life of the amp takes over though and that's what matters. I'd bet with the Diezel they cranked mids into the preamp, then tamed them before the tone stack. This effect should be what makes for such a great cutoff, though it makes higher notes - anything on the D string - sound a little weird when palm muted.
As for my assessment, I did like the Diezel quite a bit! I found it to be capable of doing a lot more than I expected and anyone who views it as a one or two trick pony is sorely misguided. Again, it was so very nice to be able to take the tone stack at face value and not have to think about how each will affect the amp's playability. However, although it can sound like many things, it will always feel like the same VH4 - something which I, as a person who enjoys a bit of variety in the feel of the instrument, would not appreciate if it were the only amp I owned.
At this point in time - I'm a 19 year old in college - I wouldn't drop $4k on it. If it blew me away, I'd have a tough time deciding between it and the Mark V, but the V has so much more to offer in the feel of the amp, where the Diezel seems to only change what it sounds like. I'd love to own one down the line because they're really cool amps and when you need something that's just simple, they'd be great to turn to. But with that said, I can only afford to own so much and the VH4 will have to wait.
If anyone else has experience with Diezel amps, I'd love to hear what you found and what you liked and disliked.
Man there's some really confusing misinformation in here, a lot of it subjectively written too.
lol no kidding!mace said:Love it…a 10 year old post comes to life!
Ended up trying a bit of everything! Rectifiers, Marks, Diezels, Bogners, Marshalls, Fenders, etc., etc.mace said:So…where did you end up? Do you still play the Mark V? Did you go Diezel and sell everything else?
I got the Mark V in 2012 and it is still my main amp.
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