What's the secret to a good live sound?

[R3dlined]

Being a newb with higher end gear (I have gone from a Dual Rectifier to a 2:90/Triaxis setup) I think the first thing I had to learn for myself is listening to a good tone on a CD is NOT what my amp is going to sound like. I have a JPMM guitar and kept trying to hone in on Petrucci type tones and I never seemed to get there. What I also can't do is get a good live sound and can't seem to find a mic position that I like.

What are people like Petrucci doing to their live sound to make it sound so god **** good? Again, I know recording is a totally different world but I can't seem to get the sustain I want or the gain with a full sound to it. Tone is subjective but what do I try and base it on if trying for a CD type tone isn't going to happen?

 

[scottcrud]

turning it up loud usually helps.

 

[R3dlined]

It's plenty loud :wink:

 

[Russ]

What are people like Petrucci doing to their live sound to make it sound so god **** good? Again, I know recording is a totally different world but I can't seem to get the sustain I want or the gain with a full sound to it. Tone is subjective but what do I try and base it on if trying for a CD type tone isn't going to happen?

Look in these people's racks and the rest of their outboard gear. There is also some production happening through the house/PA. Most people you are thinking about aren't playing solely plugged into an amp especially without some mix somewhere.

 

[ibanezgtr]

Use the Dynamic voice, put it at 3.5 or so. Also activate the Modern and Deep voicings on the 2:90, lower your gain at high volumes 6.5 or so. You can't really go wrong from here. . I like the Lead 2 Red for MARK IV type sounds Petrucci, Chevelle, Metallica And Lead 2 yellow for warm Gilmore, Eric Johnson, Petrucci leads. Hope this helps. I was getting too much mid range for my liking, until I played around with the Dynamic Voice.

 

[18&Life]

Dynamic Voice is a problem because it scoop your mids but it will add too much bass.If you use deep on 2.90 there'll be even more bass.There isn't room for a bass player,everything will muddy.
Instead DV use an graphic equalizer.It can scoop midds without adding bass unless you want it.

I use my triaxis with bass=3 mid=0 treble=6 presence=0 DV=0 and modern in 2.90 . I use G Major equalizer to scoop mids.

Some people say that triaxis can't get rectifier tones,they are wrong because they muddy their tone with too much bass.Triaxis have enough distortion to build a rectifier tone. :wink:

 

[ibanezgtr]

This message is to help R3dlined!!

Petrucci used the Dynamic voice at 3.5 Check pictures on his website. There are always different factors, I have petrucci's pickups etc.. so I can achieve the sound with no effort. Mesa was really close to my sound with the #10 factory preset, has the sound voicing of the Mark IV or Mark IIc+ which I think blows away a Dual Rectifier (3.5 on DV), plus has shredability and originality. If you look at the curve on many people's Mark IV's or C+you will see a dip in the EQ like the equivilant of 3.5 on the Dynamic voice, you don't really see many people with it all set to 0, like 0 on the DV. Use your ear, I get plenty of mids 4.5 or so and bass is at 4.5, perfect to make it Growl but still tight and focused, I play progressive Metal like Dream Theater, Rush and Tool. If you want suggestions from someone who does his research, I'm happy to help and these settings will sound great in any large LA venue, I play there weekly.

 

[18&Life]

Petrucci used the Dynamic voice at 3.5 Check pictures on his website.

This is ridiculous,I don't want Petrucci's tone ! :evil:

Dude I think you missed my point.
I don't want petrucci's tone or yours.I have mine.
I was saying some tips about how to sound good at the stage.

BTW at 91-92 Pretucci triaxis tones were awful at the stage (rhythm guitars),very weak,he used to use that awful led1 red rectifier mode (I hate it ).
I hate DV I prefer to use a graphic equalizer .
If everybody use DV at 3,5, if petrucci uses this way I really don't care.
I don't think we all have to have the same tone !!!! :wink:

 

[ned]

Crank the mids. The thing about live sound is you have to fit into the mix versus playing at home. When you play by yourself it will not sound as good as when playing with the band.

The trick is to make it sound good in the audience not the stage.

 

[R3dlined]

I have two basic clips up here:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=712017

Test 1 I think I like more and tried a different mic placement for that (stright at the speaker about half way from the cone to the edge). Also using LEAD2 Yellow.

I never test tone in an alone situation and there is another guitar player with us, but with my Triaxis and Dsonic I have a LOT of MIDs and stand out in the mix a lot more.

 

[Rayder]

his is ridiculous,I don't want Petrucci's tone !

Dude I think you missed my point.
I don't want petrucci's tone or yours.I have mine.

dude, redlined is asking how to get those tones, not you. and ibanezgtr was giving an answer to redlined, not you. please take more time to read the posts before you make stupid comments.

I use my triaxis with bass=3 mid=0 treble=6 presence=0 DV=0 and modern in 2.90

and you seriously cannot figure out why your tone sounds so scooped with dynamic voice on? try putting the mids above 0, and turning the bass down a bit. the dynamic voice is a great tool to use. you just have to learn how to use it properly. but if you get a good sound out of your amp, good for you.

as for redlined,

having a good look at his rig helps. of course you can get close but you wont get there, considering he has all that gear in his rack. bare in mind that you have to have the technique down as well. his tone comes from the settings on his rig and the way he plays guitar. however, dont give up just yet.

 

[18&Life]

dude, redlined is asking how to get those tones, not you. and ibanezgtr was giving an answer to redlined, not you. please take more time to read the posts before you make stupid comments.

So sorry I thought it was for me.

 

[18&Life]

I use my triaxis with bass=3 mid=0 treble=6 presence=0 DV=0 and modern in 2.90

and you seriously cannot figure out why your tone sounds so scooped with dynamic voice on? try putting the mids above 0, and turning the bass down a bit. the dynamic voice is a great tool to use. you just have to learn how to use it properly. but if you get a good sound out of your amp, good for you.

I don't want more mids,triaxis is already full of mids,I use it with mids =0 and scooped 1.000 KHz mids with gmajor eq.
As I said when you increase DV you cut mids BUT you ADD bass.I don't want more bass. :wink:

 

[ibanezgtr]

My thoughts exactly Rayder, I figured I wouldn't waste my time trying to force comprehension.

 

[V!N]

Seems everybody has his own "secret" for a good sound. I once opened for a band that didn't have the guitars or bass audible on stage. The bass used DI, the guitarists isolated cabs and everybody was wearing in-ear stuff.

They sounded exactly like on their albums, which was their goal. Personally I thought it was a bit to "polished", I kinda missed that raw, raunchy edge and direct pressure that I feel is a part of a live good live sound.

 

[ned]

Guitar is a mid-range instrument if you want to cut through the band you need to bump the mids.

You need to dial in your amp with the whole band playing doing it in your bedroom will get you nowhere.

 

[kmoed]

Guitar is a mid-range instrument if you want to cut through the band you need to bump the mids.

You need to dial in your amp with the whole band playing doing it in your bedroom will get you nowhere.

Agree with the above, Mid Range is going to make you cut through. You have to find your live sound when playing with the band. You'll never get it right trying to figure it out solo. You're always going to share some space with other members in the band so you need to compensate when they are present. You should always rehearse in the exact same setup as you would on stage.