Mesa Rectoverb 25 - Bleeding signal when Modern 10/25W

[dearco19]

Hi All,

This is demonstration of an ''issue'' that I'm experiencing with the Mesa Rect-O-Verb 25:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qm-Q10sr4nI

As you can hear in the video the signal is bleeding a fizzy/treble sound that escapes when the volume is at cero. And when I increase the volume more and more the fizzy/treble sound is mixed with the signal until it disappears. I have compared the same Channel/Mode with a Mesa Roadster and the signal bleeding was minimum or none.

I already changed the position of my power and preamp tubes between them but the ''issue'' persist.

Has someone experienced the same with this amp?? Please let me know

BR,
Dennis
____________
Mesa Rectoverb 25 Combo
Blackstar S1 104 EL34 100W
Blackstar S1 PRO 4x12 Cabinet
Schecter Hellraiser C-1 Extreme
Jackson Dinky DXMG

 

[Addictedtokaos]

As posted on your YT channel, I think this is normal. My mini Rec does the same thing.

 

[dearco19]

Thanks Jesse! My rectoverb was made 4-2-2014 so I believe it is normal in these 25W amps. Not a nice thing but when you turn up the volume the sound is killer!!!?

BR,
Dennis
____________
Mesa Rectoverb 25 Combo
Blackstar S1 104 EL34 100W
Blackstar S1 PRO 4x12 Cabinet
Schecter Hellraiser C-1 Extreme
Jackson Dinky DXMG

 

[Shemham]

Practically the loop can be considered to function as a series loop. If I'm not mistaken, Mesa has left some very small signal that passes through. So on low volume it could act like a parallel loop. It's not noticeable when you turn the volume up and it's more apparent in the Modern mode where the negative feedback circuit is ditched from the circuit raising the overall volume. I believe it has has some function in preventing pops when switching loop on/off.

This is all mostly based on my experience with the bigger Multi-Watt Rectifiers, but I assume it's the same with the Mini Rectos.

 

[dearco19]

Thanks Shemham! I believe that could be a valid reason. I wish this amp came with a master volume and separate channel volumes in order to have the best sound at low volume. I guess I will have to buy an amp power attenuator.

BR,
Dennis
____________
Mesa Rectoverb 25 Combo
Blackstar S1 104 EL34 100W
Blackstar S1 PRO 4x12 Cabinet
Schecter Hellraiser C-1 Extreme
Jackson Dinky DXMG

 

[Addictedtokaos]

The amp good sound even at low volumes. IMO, there is no need for an attenuator, Ive traveled down that path.

I done quite a bit of research and found guys using amps without output volume adding a volume pot in the fx loop to create a master. So I bought quality components and built a volume pad. After testing, I found I prefer the amp at low volume without attenuation. Using a volume attenuator in the fx loop just seems to take some of the definition/harmonics away.

 

[antikue]

I had that exact problem and asked Mesa Boogie about it. It's designed that way, not a bug, and apparently due to a tube/tubes halves interacting with each other. Not just a loop related phenomenon, since disabling the loop doesn't solve the problem. My Multi-watt does it too, Roadster not so much. I recommend getting a good EQ pedal and tame the volume with it. You can simultaneously boost the frequencies "lost" due to volume drop. I use the MXR 10-band myself, a piece of equipment well worth its weight in gold

 

[KiwiJoe]

I've never noticed this "problem", but, then again, I've never attempted to play with the volume on zero either. :|

 

[Trotter]

Tried it on mine and no Bleed through in any Channel/Mode.

 

[Dreamtheaterrules]

I've never noticed this "problem", but, then again, I've never attempted to play with the volume on zero either. :|

My wife asks me to do it all the time! Actually, if I played like you, maybe she wouldn't mind so much. Lol

 

[dearco19]

The amp good sound even at low volumes. IMO, there is no need for an attenuator, Ive traveled down that path.

I done quite a bit of research and found guys using amps without output volume adding a volume pot in the fx loop to create a master. So I bought quality components and built a volume pad. After testing, I found I prefer the amp at low volume without attenuation. Using a volume attenuator in the fx loop just seems to take some of the definition/harmonics away.

Have you tried an ordinary amp power attenuator, the one that connects between the amp and the speaker? Like the following:
http://www.suhr.com/jim-kelley-power-attenuator.html

 

[dearco19]

I had that exact problem and asked Mesa Boogie about it. It's designed that way, not a bug, and apparently due to a tube/tubes halves interacting with each other. Not just a loop related phenomenon, since disabling the loop doesn't solve the problem. My Multi-watt does it too, Roadster not so much. I recommend getting a good EQ pedal and tame the volume with it. You can simultaneously boost the frequencies "lost" due to volume drop. I use the MXR 10-band myself, a piece of equipment well worth its weight in gold

Excellent!! Thanks for the info and the recommendation! I will consider to buy an EQ Pedal, could be a MXR or the new Mesa 5 band EQ
I also asked to Mesa about this bleeding signal problem and this is what they replied:

Volume at 0 will still bleed signal – but do you actually use the amp at this setting?
Please let me know if you've got any questions or need assistance in any way. Thanks!

Garey Noble
Customer Service/Product Specialist

I wish they can give more information about any issue, thats why I came to you guys. Thanks

 

[dearco19]

Tried it on mine and no Bleed through in any Channel/Mode.

Lucky you man!

What amp do you have, combo or head??
Have you changed the tubes??
When was made your amp?

 

[Trotter]

The head
No change all stock

 

[blackoutshred]

the loop been some kind of parallel at low volumes make sense (that's why when you play a loop, let's say in the flashback, you can hear the signal been compressed lots), maybe that's the reason of the "bleeding" signal... well that and the negative feedback circuit thing. One thing is for sure tho, running the modern mode at 25w on a "real" beadroom situation is not the best you can do (on giging levels kicks), the fact that the real dry signal mix with that bleed one makes the thing sorta unusable, radio like, let's say not pleasurable enough. Guess you are limited to 10w on that modern mode (or kill your neighbors and mom :lol: ) and 25w in the others 3 modes. Either way... that amp kills it! Can't tell why this is happening to some and not all of you...

Alan,

Cheers.

 

[Addictedtokaos]

The amp good sound even at low volumes. IMO, there is no need for an attenuator, Ive traveled down that path.

I done quite a bit of research and found guys using amps without output volume adding a volume pot in the fx loop to create a master. So I bought quality components and built a volume pad. After testing, I found I prefer the amp at low volume without attenuation. Using a volume attenuator in the fx loop just seems to take some of the definition/harmonics away.

Have you tried an ordinary amp power attenuator, the one that connects between the amp and the speaker? Like the following:
http://www.suhr.com/jim-kelley-power-attenuator.html

I was advised by a few forum members here that an Speaker attenuator is great for small gigs when you want to tame a dual or triple's volume, but supposedly you wont get very tone and bedroom levels due to the lack of output to the speaker.

What are you trying to achieve? sorry, Im confused....

If you want no sound you can either turn your guitar volume to 0 (thats what I do) or buy a tuner pedal that mutes while tuning.

 

[dearco19]

The amp good sound even at low volumes. IMO, there is no need for an attenuator, Ive traveled down that path.

I done quite a bit of research and found guys using amps without output volume adding a volume pot in the fx loop to create a master. So I bought quality components and built a volume pad. After testing, I found I prefer the amp at low volume without attenuation. Using a volume attenuator in the fx loop just seems to take some of the definition/harmonics away.

Have you tried an ordinary amp power attenuator, the one that connects between the amp and the speaker? Like the following:
http://www.suhr.com/jim-kelley-power-attenuator.html

I was advised by a few forum members here that an Speaker attenuator is great for small gigs when you want to tame a dual or triple's volume, but supposedly you wont get very tone and bedroom levels due to the lack of output to the speaker.

What are you trying to achieve? sorry, Im confused....

If you want no sound you can either turn your guitar volume to 0 (thats what I do) or buy a tuner pedal that mutes while tuning.

Sure let me explain:
This signal that is bleeding is different than the original or normal. How can I note the difference? Because when the volume is at 0 you are able to hear only a treble/harsh sound, is not loud but is there. I also noticed that if you turn down the gain it will disappear.
Now, while you are turning up the volume, more and more in 25W mode, both signals get mixed until the main or normal signal is louder and covers the other, so at this point the amp is really loud and sounds perfect, best tone ever for a 25W amp! But you cannot play at bedroom levels of course, that's why I'm considering to buy an amp power attenuator but before doing that I want to change all the tubes just to be sure.

The point is that I don't want to hear that noisy signal mixed in the best channel/mode of this amp at bedroom level.

 

[fr0sty]

That's my experience also. If the mini rec was my only amp and I needed high gain tones at bedroom volumes, I wouldn't keep the mini. If mesa can correct that, I think they should.

 

[KiwiJoe]

If there was ever a perfect example of "First World Problems" this is it. I think some of you just have unreasonably ridiculous expectations. I don't recall the Mini Rec or the ROV being marketed as amps that will give "searing, convincing high-gain tones at volumes low enough so as not to disturb the wife and kids in the other room at 2 o'clock in the morning" - and let me put that in a time frame: EVER. These amps are meant to be played in the real world - either in the studio or in live band situations with a reasonable amount of signal going to the power section.

Seriously, if you want whisper quiet, get a SS profiling amp with a headphone jack. Or get the Cab Clone.

 

[fr0sty]

There's no reason it shouldn't sound fine at the bottom end of the volume taper. There is a nasty direct, or out of phase tone that is blended in on the gain channel at the bottom end of the volume taper. It really sounds like *****. It's worse on the modern mode and worse in 25 watt mode.

If I had to guess, I would bet that more amps are played at home vs the "real world".

Fwiw, I also own a Mark V and pod x3/pod farm. The Mark V sound great at the lowest end of the volume taper. The mini does not.

If there was ever a perfect example of "First World Problems" this is it. I think some of you just have unreasonably ridiculous expectations. I don't recall the Mini Rec or the ROV being marketed as amps that will give "searing, convincing high-gain tones at volumes low enough so as not to disturb the wife and kids in the other room at 2 o'clock in the morning" - and let me put that in a time frame: EVER. These amps are meant to be played in the real world - either in the studio or in live band situations with a reasonable amount of signal going to the power section.

Seriously, if you want whisper quiet, get a SS profiling amp with a headphone jack. Or get the Cab Clone.