Overdrive/Distortion Pedals - Why Do You Use Them?

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KiwiJoe

KiwiJoe

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If you spent the money to buy a MESA/Boogie, why do you use an OD or distortion pedal? Regardless of the model, it's an amp that is renowned for its overdrive tones, and I'm just curious as to why so many people on this forum and elsewhere seem to feel the need for a pedal. Is it the kind of music you play (metal, etc.) where there isn't enough gain available in the amp and it needs to be augmented? I'm asking because I bought a Boogie for its tone, and it just seems that using a pedal kind of defeats the purpose; that is, if you're using a pedal, the amp merely becomes nothing more than a power source.

Again, I'm not judging; just confused and seeking clarification.
 
Most people put an overdrive in front of the amp, not for the overdrives distortion, but to boost the input to make the input tubes scream.

If you noticed the bottom end on the recto is a little loose, by taking a Overdrive pedal, maxing the level but keeping the gain/drive all the way down you basically add a boost that tightens up the bottom end.

There are some people that do run a distortion pedal for tone, but they are few compared to the people that just run one as a boost.
 
A lot of people use an overdrive as a tone shaper. A tubescreamer for example changes the the way the tone sounds before it enters the amp, which changes the way the amp reacts and shapes it internally.

A Big Muff into a Recto is kind of cool too. It's not at all what I expected...
 
It also acts like you add a channel. Hit a semi clean channel with an OCD and you have a nice crunchy channel.

I feel a boost will put more sizzle into a clean channel and retain the dynamic, or less compressed nature of the higher gain channels.

YMMV
 
I tend to use pedals to smooth out the recto tone. I feel it's too 'grainy'. Best way I can describe it is comparing large rocks in a cement mixer vs sand in a cement mixer. One is thumping, the other is smoother.

Another reason is to add more compression. The recto on it's own doesn't lend itself well to good singing leads. As a rhythm machine it's great...

TS type pedals work well but I feel that only a tone control doesn't allow enough EQ shaping, so I place an EQ pedal after a TS type pedal plus another EQ pedal in the loop for final tone shaping.

Sometimes I stack 2 OD pedals, usually a Distortion with an OD. The chain-order depends on the pedals. Whether I use one or two pedals, I add some gain from the pedals and adjust the gain on the amp. This smooths out the gain 'structure'. I don't use the pedals as a 'clean' boost as others have said.

One of the nicest pedals I've used is the original Marshall Drive Master pedal as well as Wampler's Pinnacle and Plextortion. Other pedals were MI Audio's Crunch Box into Tube Zone on the amps clean-pushed channel.... excellent.

There's plenty of reasons to use pedals. One amp cannot do all things but maybe it can do most of what you want with some help.
 
I use my pedalboard, rather than guitar volume, to set tone and drive. I feel that my guitar volume is too likely to move around on me.

So where a lot of people will set a bit higher gain in the amp and roll back the guitar volume to clean it up, I set low gain in the amp and use OD pedals with a little bit of gain to add to it. I also use the ODs for tone.

I have a BB Pre set for more low-end tone, and an OD808 set normal, which is to say mid-boost. Both have just a little drive. Gain on each is set to 10:30.

I can use either pedal, or both in series to get MANY levels of drive and tone. My Electradyne has 3 modes:

Clean = I run this pristine clean, like a jazz amp
Clean + OD808 = just a hint of breakup, still basically clean but with more sustain, Fender blackface-y
Clean + BB Pre = nice bluesy tone with some breakup
Clean + OD808 + BB Pre = bluesy solo tone with lots of sustain, pedals dominate the tone
VLO = Low gain, kind of Marshall plexi with not much gain, but still broken up. About equal to Clean + BB Pre, but different tone
VLO + OD808 = A bit more clarity (from the mid-boost) plus a bit more sustain
VLO + BB Pre = More gainy solo tone with lots of clarity and character from the VLO mode
VLO + OD808 + BB Pre = Smokin' solo tone, like IIC+
VHI = Van Halen I. About equal to VLO + BB Pre, but a bit more scratchy-sounding
VHI + OD808 = Hair metal, good sustainy solo tone with lots of clarity and punch
VHI + BB Pre = Liquid sustainy lead tone
VHI + BB Pre + OD808 = Super over the top sustain, but still good clarity, not totally dominated by the pedals

Of these, I am most likely to use

Clean
VLO
VLO + BB Pre (this is magical)
VHI
VHI + OD808

For leads, anything goes. When I'm really ripping it up with legato and feedback, it will be VLO + OD808 + BB Pre.

If I had to play just with the amp and no pedals, I would push up the gain, use my guitar volume, and probably be just fine.

For my Mini Recto, I use the lead channel for metal crunch. In order to get some mid-gain tones I use a BB Pre. I'm not as happy with the BB on the Recto. I also use an OD808, but just as a boost.
 
Blaklynx said:
One of the nicest pedals I've used is the original Marshall Drive Master pedal
Click to expand...

Yeah, I've sold a bunch of gear over the years and that's one of the few things that I wish I hung onto.

Anyway, while I'm already replying I might as well address the original question. I dial in my amp just on the edge of break-up (Mesa Maverick I'm talkin about here). And though I do ride the volume knob and change p/u positions to step into cleaner or more distorted territory, it's nice to be able to add some extra girth and aggression here and there. Or a more liquidy lead tone with sustain. I've never been a fan of the lead channel of that amp.

There's no right or wrong way to do it, but I do feel that there are more and less effective ways to set up your gear for what YOU are trying to accomplish, creatively. A lot of it has to do with how you think about the relationship between musician and equipment. I used to have a rigid idea of "this is my clean tone, this is my crunch, this is my lead" but over the years I'm more into the "shades of grey" approach. If it sounds good, it IS good.
 
Thank you all who have responded thus far. It is really great that each of you has expressed not only what you use, but why, which is what was originally asked.

For those who have said they rely mostly on the amp and just use a pedal for a boost, I get that. I use a simple GE-7 in the loop for a bit of a mid boost to get a Mark I-ish sound for certain things (like Santana covers), but I still rely on the primary relationship/combination of my guitar, preamp, and mains to give the vast majority of my tonal shape. There are quite a few, though, who have said they leave the amp relatively "clean" and use the pedal(s) to get the majority of their tone/overdrive, which still begs the question as to why use a MESA when it seems like just about any loud, single channel amp with or without a master volume would get the same result.

I might work this up into an actual survey and break it down into demographics like age, type of music you play, type of guitars (not only brand, but types - hollow, semi-hollow, solid; pickups - single coil or humbucker), whether you use the amp or an OD/distortion pedal. It may have to be individual surveys from which I collate the data and generate a statistical analysis. I think the results would be enlightening (or not; I'm an engineer, so statistical data is always relevant). If I do this I hope you all will participate.

Cheers,
Joe
 
Don't forget about special sounds either. A high gain rectifier isn't going to approximate a cool vintage fuzz tone without a cool vintage fuzz in front of it. Sometimes an amp purchase is one of compromise, where you have MOST of the sounds you need, but a few pedals can fill in the gaps in your wish list. At the end of the day, It doesn't really matter what amp or pedals you run if your guitar sound pleases you IMO.
 
I use an overdrive to color my tone. I'll run a Tube Screamer through the effects loop of my Road King once in a while. It's there to add almost a customized feel.
 
I think your perception of what an overdrive pedal actually is isn't 100% clear. Most people don't slap a Tubescreamer in front of their clean channel and call it a day with that being their source of gain. It's also not used to give you more gain. What it does do is.... if you put a Tubescreamer in front of an already distorted amp, especially high gain, it vastly improves the feel and response of the amp. As people have said, it tightens it up. Rectos can get pretty loose and muddy sounding so they especially benefit from an OD. Every amp I've ever had has benefited from an OD. With that said, you run the gain on the OD at 0 and the level at 10. This isn't exactly the same thing as using an EQ as a boost. An EQ boost doesn't give you the same tightening effect.
 
SonVolt said:
I think your perception of what an overdrive pedal actually is isn't 100% clear.
Click to expand...
On the contrary, I am perfectly "clear" on what an OD pedal is and does - which is why I, myself personally, don't use them anymore. I really think it comes down to the type of music one plays. I have a Mini Rec and to my ears, it is not muddy or loose or anything of the sort; I don't use tons of distortion, so maybe I don't face the tonal challenges that others do.

Perhaps it is an age thing; I don't know. I'm old and "old-school" as they say these days. I play a certain type of guitar matched with a certain type of amp and a certain type of speaker(s) and cabinet to get a certain type of sound. I carefully select those items to work together. I work with the amp's tone and gain controls, along with the volume and tone pots and pickups to color the tone. For me, the two channels and the two settings per channel give me more than enough options to shape the sound almost infinitely. It's all about subtleties. But, that's just me; that's how I do it.

Like I said, I was just curious and somewhat confused because there just seemed to be a disconnect between myself and so many others regarding this topic. It just seemed to me that if one has to use all these different boxes and such that perhaps the initial selection of the core instruments wasn't right to begin with. And, let me reiterate: I am not judging; I apologize if it came out that way. I asked the question to further my own understanding and not to insult anybody about their own personal choices.
 
KiwiJoe said:
It just seemed to me that if one has to use all these different boxes and such that perhaps the initial selection of the core instruments wasn't right to begin with.
Click to expand...


No offense but I still don't think you understand the purpose of an OD. If you did you wouldn't keep saying things like this. It has nothing to do with picking the wrong instruments.
 
SonVolt said:
KiwiJoe said:
It just seemed to me that if one has to use all these different boxes and such that perhaps the initial selection of the core instruments wasn't right to begin with.
Click to expand...


No offense but I still don't think you understand the purpose of an OD. If you did you wouldn't keep saying things like this. It has nothing to do with picking the wrong instruments.
Click to expand...

+1.

If someone likes the sound of a boosted Recto then they should boost their Recto. To suggest that their preference for the boosted sound means they picked the wrong amp is just asinine.

I generally can't stand using an overdrive with any amp because I hate the way they feel to play through, but all it takes is one session with one in the signal path to realize why some people like that sound.
 
KiwiJoe said:
Thank you all who have responded thus far. It is really great that each of you has expressed not only what you use, but why, which is what was originally asked.

For those who have said they rely mostly on the amp and just use a pedal for a boost, I get that. I use a simple GE-7 in the loop for a bit of a mid boost to get a Mark I-ish sound for certain things (like Santana covers), but I still rely on the primary relationship/combination of my guitar, preamp, and mains to give the vast majority of my tonal shape. There are quite a few, though, who have said they leave the amp relatively "clean" and use the pedal(s) to get the majority of their tone/overdrive, which still begs the question as to why use a MESA when it seems like just about any loud, single channel amp with or without a master volume would get the same result.

I might work this up into an actual survey and break it down into demographics like age, type of music you play, type of guitars (not only brand, but types - hollow, semi-hollow, solid; pickups - single coil or humbucker), whether you use the amp or an OD/distortion pedal. It may have to be individual surveys from which I collate the data and generate a statistical analysis. I think the results would be enlightening (or not; I'm an engineer, so statistical data is always relevant). If I do this I hope you all will participate.

Cheers,
Joe
Click to expand...

Maybe I can add some light here in terms of your question about running a 'clean' amp and using pedals instead.

A recto amp is the only amp that has the 'recto' sound.... goes without saying. There is only one pedal that I feel is the closest and it's Wampler's Triple Wreck.

If you have a recto amp, you have the recto tone. This amp can do more *if* you use other pedals.... you can smooth it out, make it creamy, make it sing, sound 'marshall-ish', and so on. Will it sound like a Fender or a Marshall? Not quite but close enough. The tonal options are there, if you play with the different modes and explore. Many think the recto amp is just a metal amp full of recto tone. How wrong can these people be?

Other amps can do the above to a degree, too, but they can't do the basic recto tone. That's where they fail. You can use Wampler's Triple Wreck, get reasonably close, but it does lack the amps basic recto flavour. It doesn't quite have that 'grind' of the recto sound. I have this pedal and it's a great pedal, no doubt.

If you desire the recto tone as a basic tone but want a few other flavours, this is the amp to get. There is no other recto amp.

If you desire a recto tone but are using another amp (say a 'cleanish' amp) you won't get the recto tone with pedals (Wampler's Triple Wreck is close and excellent, but not quite there).

What most are doing is keeping the fundamental basic recto tone and using pedals to shape or tone that fundamental tone. They're not replacing it. I tend to use pedals to get to a 'half-way' mark, recto tone and 'marshall-ish' tone. I've explained this in other posts but haven't got time to link here.

If you want everything, buy a modelling amp..... :lol:
 
SonVolt said:
KiwiJoe said:
It just seemed to me that if one has to use all these different boxes and such that perhaps the initial selection of the core instruments wasn't right to begin with.
Click to expand...


No offense but I still don't think you understand the purpose of an OD. If you did you wouldn't keep saying things like this. It has nothing to do with picking the wrong instruments.
Click to expand...
No worries. it is impossible to offend me. However, it does seem a bit presumptuous to assume I don't understand something on it's face; I may not understand why YOU use it, but I definitely understand why I don't use it. And, actually, now I have a little better idea of why you and others use OD pedals. Thank you. We just have different approaches as to how we go about getting what we're after.
 
screamingdaisy said:
If someone likes the sound of a boosted Recto then they should boost their Recto. To suggest that their preference for the boosted sound means they picked the wrong amp is just asinine.
Click to expand...
And by all means I would never tell somebody that they don't like a sound if, in fact, they like the sound. I said that the means or method of acquiring that sound was beyond my comprehension since it is an approach quite different than my own. I stated that is "how it seems" to me. I never referred to anybody's choice as asinine or used any other type of ad hominem. Congratulations.
screamingdaisy said:
I generally can't stand using an overdrive with any amp because I hate the way they feel to play through, but all it takes is one session with one in the signal path to realize why some people like that sound.
Click to expand...
And that is what I was trying to figure out: WHY they like the sound they like, and, most people were able to elucidate that. I was not trying to create a sh^t-storm. It was for my own edification in an attempt, through dialogue, to overcome some preconceptions I may have had.
 
Blaklynx said:
Maybe I can add some light here in terms of your question about running a 'clean' amp and using pedals instead.

A recto amp is the only amp that has the 'recto' sound.... goes without saying. There is only one pedal that I feel is the closest and it's Wampler's Triple Wreck.

If you have a recto amp, you have the recto tone. This amp can do more *if* you use other pedals.... you can smooth it out, make it creamy, make it sing, sound 'marshall-ish', and so on. Will it sound like a Fender or a Marshall? Not quite but close enough. The tonal options are there, if you play with the different modes and explore. Many think the recto amp is just a metal amp full of recto tone. How wrong can these people be?

Other amps can do the above to a degree, too, but they can't do the basic recto tone. That's where they fail. You can use Wampler's Triple Wreck, get reasonably close, but it does lack the amps basic recto flavour. It doesn't quite have that 'grind' of the recto sound. I have this pedal and it's a great pedal, no doubt.

If you desire the recto tone as a basic tone but want a few other flavours, this is the amp to get. There is no other recto amp.

If you desire a recto tone but are using another amp (say a 'cleanish' amp) you won't get the recto tone with pedals (Wampler's Triple Wreck is close and excellent, but not quite there).

What most are doing is keeping the fundamental basic recto tone and using pedals to shape or tone that fundamental tone. They're not replacing it. I tend to use pedals to get to a 'half-way' mark, recto tone and 'marshall-ish' tone. I've explained this in other posts but haven't got time to link here.

If you want everything, buy a modelling amp..... :lol:
Click to expand...
When you put it that way, I get it now. Thank you for that.
 
KiwiJoe,

If you've already decided that you don't believe in boosting your guitar with a pedal in front of your amp because of your personal philosophy on guitar tone and signal path, then why ask? It seems you already know all of the reasons and applications for boost/od/distortion pedals. There isn't any secret or magic going on, it is as simple as changing the shape of the signal your amp sees, which clearly you understand.

I don't mean to seem argumentative, but you are the one who started this thread, with a question. Now it seems you have an axe to grind trying to convince us that we are foolish or less experienced with "tone" because some of us use a pedal for our guitar sound. Like I said before, it doesn't matter how I get there, with no pedals, or 10 pedals, or 1 amp, 4 amps..........it doesn't matter if after it all I am satisfied. There is no "right way".
 

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