Sound Clip..... Mark V CabClone recording

[OldTelecasterMan]

For quite some time I have been researching and came up with a stereo rig. I just completed it. Here is the layout Guitar to a sure wireless on the board to an Xotic SP Compressor to the Crybaby then to the input of the Mark V. Effects loop to the dual MXR Carbon Copy pedals return to the amp. From the amp speaker output to the CabClone 8ohm. I use the CabClone thru output to a 2x12 compact boogie cabinet. Then line out of the CabClone to a Strymon Blue Sky, stereo to the Strymon Ola Stereo Chorus two cables to a 12 channel stereo graphic EQ to be able to adjust the output line level to a 150 watt Yamaha power amp connected to the boogie 2x12 vertical cabinets. I am going to check out a Stereo SIMUL-CLASS 2:NINETY to replace the Yamaha but for the moment it is what I have.

The Strymon pedals are very transparent, true bypass, when disengaged with no noticeable tone difference or volume difference from the 2x12 cab connected directly to the CabClone. When either of the Strymon pedals are engaged the CabClone thru 2x12 cabinet keeps the full sound of the amp out front. By having the basically dry cab all the time it keeps things real. As the Carbon Copy pedals are in the loop it affects all cabinets when engaged.





Here is a little progression using the rig pictured in the above configuration. Recorded on an Akai DPS 12 with no effects or EQ on anything. I used the 3 pickup Telecaster pictured above in the center. I squashed the pee out of the signal with a XOTIC SP Compressor. The bass was me and my truly have not a clue bass playing but it is a Warwick Corvette bass direct into the recorder. I used a Roland TR-626 for drums using a factory pattern. Again no enhancements or post production. Guitar gear used: Mark V, Cab Clone, 2x12 compact Rectifier cabinet (to provide a load for the Cab Clone), XOTIC SP Compressor, Strymon Blue Sky Reverb, Strymon Ola Chorus, 2 Nady Audio HE-1 Hum Eliminators and a Sure wireless (it's quiet..LOL)

https://soundcloud.com/user-201672201/guitar-chorus-reverb2

 

[Wayno]

Looks awesome, would love to hear a clip of it!

 

[OldTelecasterMan]

Thank you so much for the request. I have been wanting to record (I'm a published singer song writer with a Movie credit) but my band now is a cover band and they are not interested in spending the time. When writing and recording I need to focus on only writing, recording and arranging. That is not how they want to do it. They want to squeeze it in between gigs and rehearsing and that doesn't work for me. I mean that music you record, it is your work, a piece of who you are. A half hearted, get it done, hurry and crap a lead line, lyric or vocal what kind of **** is that. So I packed up my keys, bass and recording equipment and I was going to shelf it for another year. It was killing me. So I am getting things back out, some is already setup, I'm an early riser. I'm going to see if I can get something out today. I have a piece I have been working on so I'll see how that goes. Maybe I'll get lucky and it will just flow. :lol: yea and anybody can sound like Eddie van Halen if they buy a Phase 90. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[screamingdaisy]

Did it turn out as good as you were hoping?

 

[Wayno]

I know what you mean, we tried to record a few tracks to use as demo's for my band. 2 takes and the rest of the band where bored! I guess im a bit of a perfectionist, i too believe if your gonna do something, do it to the best of your abilities. If that means 20 takes to get it right then so be it. Shame cuz the rest of my band are some seriously good musicians, and i'd love to get a good quality recording of them.

Enough about me, if you get something on tape, be sure to let us know please. Like screamingdaisy asked, does the rig live up to expectations?

 

[OldTelecasterMan]

Got recording things out and connected. As for the amp setup, it sounds fantastic. I'm having two stupid problems at the moment. I have a bad cable somewhere in the rig that is cutting out but it won't stay out long enough for me to find it. As soon as I loose signal and start to do anything it comes back on. Last night I couldn't get it to fail this afternoon it failed for about 15 seconds,... now it works. I shake cables just trying to get something to do something but nothing. AND... It also appears I have a ground loop due to the dual amp setup. So now I'm waiting on a box for that, it's ordered but I'm waiting. Bugs in the rig... happens everytime. I'm going to try recording direct and see if that works.

The 2016 Les Paul Standard Goldtop was delivered Thursday.... I'm trying to get used to the volume control locations.

 

[Wayno]

Bad cables and ground loops are a nightmare, i do the PA for my band when we play and trying track down a hum or shitty cable in the inevitable birds nest of cables is hell. Hope you get it sorted.

Nice goldtop, how does she play, great i bet! My LP studio took some getting used to after pretty much solely playing a jackson for best part of 15 years.

 

[OldTelecasterMan]

The problem was from what I can figure a cable that would loose 80% conductivity. I took the amp to Boogie, I explained what was happening and as they do they pulled it apart and checked it out. He came out and we talked a little more and he went in and checked out the power section. He could find nothing. I then realized that I had changed every cable but one. I failed to change the cable from the guitar to the amp. I have never had a cable that would sorta work. They either cut out off and on or just go dead. So while at boogie I bought a very nice heavy duty cable. I have about 3 hours on the rig and everything is working fine. I put the EL34s back in and yep... It's killer tone time.

Now it's back to my original quest. Get a recording. Waiting on the Ground loop box thingy. Hope it works.

The Les Paul sounds great and it's not overly bassey. It plays very nice and I'll be able to switch to my Telecasters with no adjustments to the amp. My only complaint is, it is too freakin nice and good looking. I use guitars. I make money with guitars. I have them fall over, stand and all on stage. I have heard people in the crowd gasp when they fall and I finish the song, stand them back up. When someone walks in the club that want's to play I hand over my guitar without a second thought. It's just part of the job. I could take either one of my Telecasters off pop some drunk on the head with it, toss it back over my shoulder and it wouldn't have a dent or be out of tune. They are worn thru the finish where my hand adjusts the volume, where my arm rests on the body, up and down the neck where I get busy the most is worn thru but they both scream and they are tough.

Now I have bought this les Paul and I'm like worried if I'm too close to something it could possibly get scratched. I untuck my shirt over my belt buckle. Most of the time I put it back in the case when I'm done instead of just leaving it on the stand next to the other guitars. I have turned in to the wuss guitarists I have laughed at when I watched guys treat their guitar like a little baby. It's sad.

 

[Wayno]

Just a thought, you have tried the ground lift switch on the cab clone haven't you? Sometimes we miss the obvious when trouble shooting?

Looking forward to the clips, bet it does sound great, love the EL34's in my V. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Know what you mean about the new baby, i was super protective of my LP when i first got it. Think it's more to do with the fact that that's the guitar i've always wanted ever since i was a kid and worshipped the likes of slash and page etc. So when i finally could afford one i baby'd it too. Not like me as i too let most anyone play my guitars if they ask and am not worried when they get splashed with beer etc at ours gigs ( which they usually do as our local crowd are pretty mental ) i just make sure i give them a good clean as regular as i can. Now the LP has a few battle scars on it i'm not so protective.

I also didn't find the LP that much more bassy than my other guitars, i would say my Schecter is the bassiest of my guitars and my Jackson is the most aggressive sounding. The LP is probably the most mid heavy of them, maybe more due to the pickup's i have in them though, EMG's in the LP, Seymour Duncan Alnico ii's in the Schecter and Duncan designed knock off's in the Jackson.

 

[OldTelecasterMan]

As for the ground loop, I tried everything, yea and the ground lift and then, went simple. I threw money at the problem, I bought a Nady Hum Eliminator. And now the hum is gone. I put it on the line out of the CabClone going to the Strymon pedals. The Hum is a problem inherent to systems that use two or more amps. It was a $27 gamble and this time it paid off. I was fully expecting to waste my money. I figured there is no way it could be as easy as putting some little box in the circuit but the Nady Hum Eliminator did the trick.

I do have another question. I have an original Cry Baby and that thing makes a noise ( a white noise ) that is unbearable when turned on and I'm not playing. When I am playing of course you cannot hear it because the sssssssss noise is drowned out buy my half hearted Wah playing. I'm not a big fan of the Wah. I use the Wah every now and then when I do a fast repeated run over and over I'll Wah on it a little. LOL... turn a few heads...Kinda sad. Like I said not my cup of tea. I see too many guitarists use them to cover up their lack of practice. Do I need to invest in a better quality Cry Baby? Do they all do that shhhhhh sssss thing when engaged?

I also switched back to the 6L6 tubes. I actually did a complete re-tube, that spanked the wallet but it made a BIG difference. The LP sounded great with the EL34s but my Telecasters, not so much, they lost depth and that Tele Sparkle. The tone seemed flatter. I loved the EL34 drive and the reactiveness as they were very dynamic. The 6L6 tubes, to me, felt better overall for my style of playing. Very hard to explain. To me one is not better than the other just different. If I only used the LP I would probably use the EL34s.

I think I'll start looking at an EL34 based amp. Maybe, I do like the tone with the LP.

 

[Wayno]

Glad you got the ground loop issue sorted, that kind of problem can be really frustrating. Bet that setup sounds sweet now!

I cant really help with regards to the crybaby, other than that i never leave mine turned on when im not using it. That is purely because i dont like the effect it has on the tone when engaged but not in use. I do quite like the effect when im using it, but like you, that is only occasionally when the lick calls for it. Many players i find rely far to heavily on effects like wah and delay etc rather than technique. I haven't noticed any white noise with mine, only the fact that i get feedback much more easily in high gain situations when the wah is on. So i have to watch out for that as a lot of my bands music is quite high gain. Do you use batteries in it or a power supply? Also, it might be an idea to spray some sort of switch cleaner on the mechanism, dirty pots can cause noise issues. I wouldn't bother investing in a better wah pedal, especially not if youre not looking for a specific wah tone, not worth the expense or effort for an occasional use effect. Just turn it off when your not using it. There is a mod you can do fairly easily to add an LED indicator so you can see when its on or off, thinking of doing that to mine as i sometimes think how come my tone has changed then realise ive left the wah turned on!

I think the valves choice is very personal, there is only one right choice and that is what ever feels right. I slightly prefered the 6L6's with my jackson for the high sparkle and beefier low end which that guitar seemed to like, however, i liked much more the EL34's with the LP and Schecter, therefore i had to compromise as i have guitars setup in different tunings which we use live so cant swap tubes during a set! No doubt that wil, change as well over time and changes to the set list. I think that is partly a problem of the whole concept of the mark v, it does do everything extremely well, but it cannot be ALL things to EVERYONE all the time. Nothing can, thats like asking an areoplane to be a transporter and a fighter plane. Ive been re dialling my tones after being told to run EL34's in variac to be safer and that has warmed em up even more to my ears, maybe as im driving them a bit more to get the same volume level? Don't know, maybe just a placebo? Sounds and feels good to me so thats all that matters.

 

[OldTelecasterMan]

The rig is very nice. The Strymon Ola (chorus) is killer. I can have it turned off then kick into a lead and turn it on and you can tell the sound got bigger but you can't tell why. The chorus is set to not use the ENV so there is no warble or sweep sound. Very cool. Having a dry cab really helps keep things focused.

I tried recording it a few nights ago. I ran the cabclone direct and center (no speaker load) then the Strymon direct with a right and left. It sounded lifeless and spongy. It sounded nothing like what comes out of the speakers. So now I gota dig through my gear and find a few microphones. I have purchased quite a few over the years but none of my new ones match. I have to find my old ones some old Sure Mics and they are in one of my many totes or a box in my storage closet in my music room. Here is where I work. The part of the room you don't see has the drum kit, bass players rig, monitors and mixer.

It works but no mater how much room I have I can always use more and more storage space. This weekend I'm going to try and finish a piece I have been working on. Writing and recording is such a slow process it kills me. I am a bit of a perfectionist so it goes real slow. Thank goodness I sequence keys and drums. That way I can adjust any little thing. I do actually play keys so I record them into the sequencer then adjust velocities, quantize, shift things around till it sounds how I want. It's 1980s technology but I love it and know it well. Pro Tools frustrates me.

 

[Wayno]

I wish i had half that much space :roll:

Proper nice looking setup tho, looks great. Hope you find a nice mic setup and get some jams recorded soon, really looking forward to hearing your rig. Wish i could get some recording done of my own, just not on the cards at the moment with working long hours to keep a house and pregnant wife on the go! No spending on guitars and stuff for me for a few years i think.

I have no experience with sequencers, i prefer Cubase, similar to Pro Tools i guess, but it works for me.
What do you record to if your not using a DAW? Do you record to an 8 track or something similar and would that be just the direct signal from the Cabclone etc?

 

[OldTelecasterMan]

For recording in the late 90s I bought an Akai DPS 12 track that I wore out. About two months ago I found an identical one to one I had on eBay that was basically new for $150. I grabbed that up. Oh here is a good one. After I bought the first recorder in the 90s I recorded a country song "I'm no hero" I had written. I took it to the local radio station and I got signed to a promotions company 7 days later. Then I got the opening spot for the 1999 Jazz Fest and then a movie deal with Franchise pictures. The song was used in the movie "Dead Simple". Not a great movie, not bad just not good enough for wide distribution only released on DVD but I got paid and my name is in the movie credits. My only claim to fame so far but I did do something. The song did get radio play in a few different states but life takes over. I was a full time single parent so I had to make a life decision and put my music aspirations on hold and raise my son.

I started sequencing on the Roland MC-500 then the MC-500 MKII and now on the MC-50. In the 80s my Dad took me to a Roland Seminar and after the class I spoke with the instructor and schooled him on exclusiv messages and PG changes. Well, it gets really tedious and complex. After about 15 minutes the instructor asked me "How did you figure that out?" It had to do with changing programs (sounds) and getting pops in the audio due to reverb changing configuration while it was still making noise. So I told him do your PG change with a patch dump then edit the dump and remove the address from the PG dump so it becomes an EX message and edits the Synth sound instead of changing patches. Sequencing for me is a great way to write music. Every instrument, sound, drums, well every aspect of everything is editable. That way you can write and get everything right before you record to disk. I also link the clocks of the sequencer and Akai so if I want to change something or add something later the Akai clocks the sequencer so what you change or add in the sequence can be re-recorded with one button. I could if I wanted have over 20 instruments in a sequence. The MC-50 can control 32 different devices.

http://www.mp3unsigned.com/Peter_Savell

Tracks 1 and 5 are sequences. Track 1: has drums and keys sequenced. I played guitar, bass and and sang all vocals.
Track 5: Drums, keys and bass are sequenced. I played guitar. The guitar on both tracks was an Ibanez 7 string through a Boogie DC-5 with a 4x12 cab

 

[Wayno]

I've got full on respect for anyone who has that level of knowledge with sequencers and the like. Never could get my head around that way of doing things. Always amazes me the intuition and sheer weight of determination that must have been involved with the people who overcame all the obstacles etc in order to achieve what they wanted with sounds and the like. i wouldn't know where to start with it all :lol: I've played around with a few VST instruments in Cubase with a MIDI keyboard and done a little programming with velocities etc with them but that's with a fairly simple graphical interface. Hats off to anyone who comes up with an idea to get around a problem.

Checked out your stuff, pretty cool! Defo looking forward to anything new you come up with with the new rig setup.

I'm soon to be a parent too, due in early june, so my guitar has had to take a back seat for a while so i can build furniture and get the things ready. No more rest for me for a few years!!!