Do I need new tubes or a new amp??

[geraci89]

Hey all, the last little while I've noticed my series 2 Rectoverb just can't seem to dial in a good all around tone. Clean channel isn't bad but when the gain gets turned up my neck pickup gets squashed for tone. Also with the clean gain turned up my distortion pedals sound like absolute garbage.

On the dirty side, everything is sounding way too piercing regardless of where my settings are at.

Some factors to consider:
I bought the amp pre-owned 5 years ago and haven't changed the Sovtek 5881's that were in it.

I also had a mishap a little while ago and dropped the amp, having one of the tubes half fall out. I think I played it that way for a while unfortunately.

I'm guessing/hoping a tube change is the answer I'm looking for. I don't know if tubes make a difference for this but is there a particular model I should look at that maybe will help my clean channel take distortion pedals with borderline broken up levels of gain?? I've heard great things about JJ's and Winged C's. I play a lot of RHCP, RATM, Foo Fighters, Billy Talent and lots of 60's/70's as well. I like the amp distortion as well but because of the annoying switch lag I want to focus on the clean for now.

Thanks for your input

 

[screamingdaisy]

If your power tubes are over 5 years old you'll probably be impressed with a new set of power tubes. I know I was the first time I ran a set to death and popped some new ones in.

Honestly, I like the Mesa 6L6s.

 

[Chester]

As the man above says

I would add that I prefer Mesa STR 420s to their current 440s in my Roadster, but YVMV

 

[Addictedtokaos]

How are you using your amp? is it bedroom level or practice/gig level?

If it is bedroom level, it may be how you are using your channel and output controls. If you are at gig level then could very well be the tubes.

 

[geraci89]

I will look into those tubes a bit. I mostly push the louder end of the "at home" level, but I've tried turning it up and that hasn't done much different.
I've also tried every combination of gain/master/output levels. Low gain high master gave me the best result but they were all still a F in my opinion.
For disclosure I haven't necessarily been diligent in letting the amp warm up. I have a bad habit of flipping both switches on right away. Would that shorten tube life?

Any other tube suggestions that might support a smooth clean breakup and carry my overdrive pedals well? Thanks for everything this far!

 

[cyber104]

Hi:

I own a Series 2 Rectoverb and it is absolutely the best amp I've ever had - and I've had a bunch.

I would replace all the tubes with Mesa branded tubes with the exception of V1 where I would use a Tungsol.

If I want a really good clean on channel 1 the gain for that channel never goes past 09:00. Sounds better than my Fender Super Reverb.

What you're describing with your RV sounds like something is definitely wrong and again, I would start with the tubes.

Hope this helps

 

[geraci89]

Thanks cyber I will check those out. Im sure this has come up a lot but is there any way at all that the channel switch delay can be fixed??

 

[Addictedtokaos]

if you are not running the output level at or above 12:00 you are going to get a sterile sound as all tone is coming from the preamp section. You need to open up the power amp section to get some bottom end happening then adjust your master accordingly.

Where it sounds like you want more breakup than gain you may have to play with the output and master controls until you get a balance that works for you. You may want to look into 6l6s or El34 that the seller has an early distortion option. Theses should let you get the tone you looking for at a lower volume. It mean they have less headroom than other tubes. Mind you it wont be practice amp quiet but it may help.

If you are not letting your tubes warm up for approx 1 minute before turning standby off, then you are shortening the life of the tube. The internals of the tubes reach high temps when fully on and need that warm up period.

Thanks cyber I will check those out. Im sure this has come up a lot but is there any way at all that the channel switch delay can be fixed??

Series 2 shouldnt have issues with channel switching. There is only a slight delay.

 

[geraci89]

thanks for the tips.

Yeah it's only a split second...but a split second too much.

 

[geraci89]

Where it sounds like you want more breakup than gain you may have to play with the output and master controls until you get a balance that works for you. You may want to look into 6l6s or El34 that the seller has an early distortion option. Theses should let you get the tone you looking for at a lower volume. It mean they have less headroom than other tubes. Mind you it wont be practice amp quiet but it may help.

This is the part that confuses me...the differences between high gain tubes, less/more headroom ect... I'll be looking for clean channel to still provide a good dynamic range for my distortion pedals even in a slightly broken up state. This is the issue I'm having now as if I dial in my clean to borderline break up, as soon as I hit a distortion pedal it sounds muddy and squashed

 

[Heritage Softail]

I would say to replace to power tubes first..... then

Put it in a closet, crack the door open, have the guita turned way down.... Get some decent gain dialed in and the MV on noon. Get away from it and slowly crank the guitar volume. As it gets to thunderous levels....

It will sound like the Recto you always wanted

Nothing takes the place of volume. It likes to get rode hard.

 

[Addictedtokaos]

This is the part that confuses me...the differences between high gain tubes, less/more headroom ect... I'll be looking for clean channel to still provide a good dynamic range for my distortion pedals even in a slightly broken up state. This is the issue I'm having now as if I dial in my clean to borderline break up, as soon as I hit a distortion pedal it sounds muddy and squashed

High gain tubes have LESS headroom because they start to distort/overdrive earlier. The way I was explained high gain tubes by an expert was, "do you have your gain knob dimmed and find you need more gain still? If yes, then high gain tubes may help you. Otherwise standard tubes are fine". With Retifiers, preamp gain usually isnt an issue.

Now if you want more tube breakup or saturation, or a breakup tone at a lower volume that's where Power Tubes with early distortion will help. In theory you will need less master volume from your preamp sections to overdrive your power section than average.

The other thing is I dont think you want to be using a Distortion pedal like an MT-2 or DeathMetal FX in front of a Rectifier. I just started the whole boosting thing with and all my research told me that OD pedals are the way to go. Not that its not possible to use a Distortion pedal but you may not get the same results.

I would agree with the above posts and say start by replacing your power tubes. It cant hurt. speak to someone via email at doug's tubes, the thetubestore, tubedpot, kcanostubes and ask questions about what tone you are trying to achieve and what tubes may help accomplish that. I personally have had excellent service with the thetubestore. Also, dont get sucked into the whole NOS realm, it can be scary! Unless you have a lot of spare $$$ stick with reasonable priced new production tubes.

 

[geraci89]

Thanks a bunch for the explanations everyone! When I finally do swap them out I'll be sure to do some demo tests and post them so others can reference!

I just realized thetubestore is within a 45 minute drive of me too. awesome!!

 

[geraci89]

Jon from thetubestore.com suggested TAD 6L6GC-STR, and from my own research I'm finding lots of people have good things to say about the SED Winged C's. Any thoughts based on my needs? Fender tones/bluesy borderline breakup for the clean channel ala John Frusciante/John Mayer/SRV but able to make OD pedals sound huge.

FYI my current OD pedals are Boss SD1 and DS2. DS2 sound ok but is finicky. SD1 sounds like crap through the ROV. Ironically enough, I used a Marshall stack at a rehearsal space and the SD1 sounded amazing and the DS2 sounded like crap...ughh

 

[Addictedtokaos]

=C= are nice but pricey. I used the tad's and liked them.

The unfortunate thing about tone chasing is that everyone's ears, set up, and signal chain is different. For example, people say Tungsol V1 is really nice. I dont play clean channel all that much, and with the C90 in the rectoverb combo, I dont think the Tungsol added anything to my ROV combo when I had it, but people with a double or triple rec and 2x12 V30s are most likely getting a completely different result.

You just have to try them yourself...take suggestions very lightly.

 

[geraci89]

Yeah with all the research I'm doing, Im finding so many different opinions. Now I'm considering maybe throwing some winged C EL34s in. Thinking maybe by avoiding the higher top and bottom of 6L6 it might help achieve a smoother break up. Worst case scenario I have a spare set of tubes

I just took off my preamp tube sleeves....all stock mesa 12ax7...they're probably 7-8 years old now too.

I think I'm gonna enjoy the new tone regardless just by the fact my tubes are probably all very tired.

 

[LithiumZero]

I've used SED as well as the TAD 6L6's. I preferred the TAD in my Roadster. I Recently dropped a set of Ruby 6L6's in and like them better than both the others. The best part is that I bought them for $40 for a QUAD from musicians Fiend! Very pleasantly surprised.

 

[geraci89]

nice! I ended up with Tung Sol EL34B's in the power section and a couple tung sol jj and sovtek preamp tubes. We'll see what happens!