Decisions decisions

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mowgli
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Decisions decisions

Post by mowgli » Tue Jan 26, 2021 8:09 am

Hi guys,

Long story coming up, and I need some advice. I have a MkV 25, which i absolutely love, trouble is, it’s too darn loud. I’ve tried the Ox Box and Tone King Ironman 2 mini attenuators, and unless the 1x12 is pushing some air it sounds rubbish. Instead of trying the Mesa Powerhouse / Waza Tube amp expander, I started going down the digital route, so this moved me onto looking into the Fractal Axe FX.
I’ve always been an analogue and simple kinda guy; guitar, cable, amp, delay pedal, but the tones the Axe FX 3 pumps out look incredible. However, I’d be planning to play it through studio monitors (which I’m told is a drastically different experience if you’re used to a speaker cab) and to get the most out of it I’d need to rely on an 11 year old MacBook “pro”. It’s a far more complex set up than buying another boogie, and just as I was about to pull the trigger, I realised it was €800+ more expensive over in Europe. I live in France, and whilst I’m happy to pay a little extra, I don’t like feeling like I’m being ripped off.

So as of this morning I started looking at Boogie options again. This is strictly for home use (at the moment) and I was wondering if the TC100 (which has the built in power soak) plus vertical 2x12 is complete overkill ? It looks massively versatile, more than the Badlanders and JP2C. The Fillmore won’t do high gain, so I guess the triple crown series is what I’m after. I like using all gain sounds from my amp, and adding delay / reverb if I need it, so the most simple set up is what I enjoy most.

I play high gain 95% of the time, in various tunings with my Eii eclipse and Xotic HSS Strat. Any advice that will help me stay THIS side of the fence will be much appreciated, or if anyone dabbled with the Axe Fx and came back to analogue land..........?

Cheers
Ben
UK

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J-P-G
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by J-P-G » Wed Jan 27, 2021 8:19 am

Hi Ben,
I have both the M V:25 top and the TC 100.
I can't compare with the Badlander or the JP2C but to be honest.... I played the 25 @ bedroom lvl via my 2x12 RoadKing Cab (which I love!!!) BUT... it was always tricky to get a bedroom lvl out of it.
After a while I got sick of the fumble with the Volume after every Jam and decided to buy another Amp for the Band and leave the 25 at home.
First pick was a TC50 combo but as soon as the TC 100 was out I ordered one for its Multi-Soak.
Got him on top of my 2x12 Roadking and that´s exact the place where he is ....
The 25 is now my Band Amp with a 1x12 WideBody closed back (can be really loud for that small thing and easily to transport) and the TC 100 is manly for bedroom and recording.
He is really versatile with the Watt switching and the pots of the Volume are really good to tune in the correct lvl.
Is a 100 watt Amp to wicked/ loud for a home/ bedroom Amp?
Yes!! But if you can tame that Beast so easily ... why not!

I love the combination and can only recommend the TC 100!
Greetings from Germany

Jan
Mesa Boogie Mark V:25 (1x12 Mesa Boogie Wide Body closed Back)
Mesa Boogie TC 100 (2x12 Mesa Boogie Road King Horizontal)
Pipper Raptor 22 Combo
Fender Princeton (HW) Combo

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mowgli
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by mowgli » Wed Jan 27, 2021 11:10 am

Thanks Jan that is very helpful. I really need to find a place in France to test one out.
Something is keeping me from going with the Axe Fx 3 even though it sounds incredible and is the sensible choice....

mace
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by mace » Wed Jan 27, 2021 10:28 pm

With the power soak option you still won’t be moving air with your speaker. In other words, if you didn’t like an attenuator the Mark V:25 I’m not sure what the advantage of the TC-100 power soak would be. That being said, the TC-50 is more bedroom friendly than the Mark V:25 just by virtue of the extra Output knob (tyou can run the channel master high but tame volume with the end of the line Output. The Mark V:25 doesn’t have this extra pot, so things are very touchy near the ‘zero’ on the Master colime knob.

Anyhoo, I ended up with the CabClone IR+ and love the attenuation feature for bedroom levels.
Rankings: #1 Mark V head, #2a TC50 combo, #2b Rectoverb 25 head

mowgli
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by mowgli » Thu Jan 28, 2021 9:45 am

No that’s the issue. Came to the conclusion that unless I’m pushing air with the cab it’ll never sound good. Even boogie told me (which sounds obvious) that upgrading to a 100w head and 2x12 cab isn’t going to help matters and the Mark V25 should be fine.

I think I’m going to try and find the Fillmore 25/50 and TC50 somewhere to play......
Completely different amps, but I may gel with one of them, and both a lot different to what I have I think......

I cancelled my Axe Fx 3 order. It’s a massively complex piece of gear, I’m a simple set up fella, and I don’t want to rely on firmware updates, reading manuals, and an old computer to get the best out of playing guitar

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J-P-G
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by J-P-G » Fri Jan 29, 2021 7:59 am

No Bedroom-Playing with moving air (speaker wise).... that should be clear.... something what someone called physics :P
I played the Fillmore 25 and 50.
Love the 25 and ist's still on my List 8)
The 50 sounds good but for me the 25 is more ... how should I explain ... rock??? (and really transportable)
Sounds great if you dime that thing! :twisted:
But to be honest... it will move Air... so it will be loud. If you play Bedroom LvL it sound still great (for me) (in comparison with the 50 watt)
In the End it's a question of what you like.
Go, play and fun with the Amp´s

Greetings Jan
Mesa Boogie Mark V:25 (1x12 Mesa Boogie Wide Body closed Back)
Mesa Boogie TC 100 (2x12 Mesa Boogie Road King Horizontal)
Pipper Raptor 22 Combo
Fender Princeton (HW) Combo

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dan_the_man
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by dan_the_man » Fri Feb 19, 2021 5:51 am

If you don't have some air moving you can't get that punch and gainy feel we all know and love.
Instead to go fully digital, i'd try something like load box/cab simulator: your amp (whatever you choose)into a load box/cab sim directly into your audio card. It should be a good compromise to get a good sound in your ears and under you fingers with a reasonable bedroom volume.
The point is bypassing the amp's cabinet and make some studio monitor do the job because of course, monitor's speakers are smaller and easier to move.
And when you get inspired simply press rec and get your best riffs safe. :twisted:

mowgli
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by mowgli » Fri Mar 05, 2021 9:05 am

Well, I went around the houses, ordered a load of stuff with free returns and learned a lot along the way !
Fractal FM3, sounds amazing, but took away all the fun and simplicity of sitting down and just playing guitar. Editing on a computer, scrolling through a complicated box, not for me. Playing through monitors was fine, providing you’re always sat in the right position.
Tried the Mkv25 and and Fillmore 50 through the Ox DI and headphones, very unimpressed again, no fullness, it’s just not the same.
So after all that, I’m keeping both my Mesa heads, 1x12 recto cab, will add the Waza Tube amp expander and matching Fillmore Cab, and only play through those. I thought why would anyone buy another tube head when all this digital tech is so good ?! But it’s just not the same.
Tube all the way baby

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Don
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by Don » Fri Mar 05, 2021 10:16 am

I was thinking about volume issues and pushing air and all that and it made me think of when my daughter was playing clarinet in the house. A single clarinet can reach over 110 db! She didn't play that loud, but It was loud!

I find that, when my amps sound good, they're at least 100 db.

Music is loud!

mowgli
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by mowgli » Fri Mar 05, 2021 4:28 pm

There really is no other way Don.
I can try, I can achieve a similar tone, but it won’t howl until I turn the knob a little higher......at least I’ve stopped looking for perfection, turns out I already had it

dan_the_man
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by dan_the_man » Tue Mar 09, 2021 10:17 am

Well... you need a certain loudness of course, a costant 100db signal is more than enough in a small place to make your ears bleeding. It may sounds stupid, but i think the best compromise is try and play live as more as you can. That's the "real" tone, the one we should experience the most.
Everything apart from that, is just a compromise, and we should take it as it is.
If there was no other gear than 50/100 no master volume amps, we'd all probably spend more time giggin than tryin and make them sound quieter at home.
I guess some not-too-young fellas in this group know something about...

mowgli
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by mowgli » Tue Mar 16, 2021 6:58 am

Amen, however, I’ve found the answer ! It only took me nearly a year. Enter the Waza Tube Amp Expander. Fantastic, well made, and adjustable reactive load to whatever amp you plug into it. Tried it with the Mark V25, and it’s brilliant on the recommended settings for a recto, also it sends the built in effects through my speaker cab, which the Ox didn’t. So compressor, delay and reverb, built in effects loop and the solo / eq button is a great tone shaper, I’ve barely scratched the surface but I knew in 5 minutes it was what I was looking for.
The Fillmore 50 is epic, it just needed taming, as the master volume is really just another tone control. Very happy with my current set up at last !

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Djentle_Boogieman
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Re: Decisions decisions

Post by Djentle_Boogieman » Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:58 pm

Actually I had a lot of conversations with two different tech experts that also have built a lot of reactive loads themselves and the WAZA load isn't all that good quality. It doesn't match a real speaker impedance curve but has a smiley curve just as the two notes stuff and the overpriced OX. Not only will it loose a small bit of clarity what you may or may not hear how well trained your ears are, it will also shorten the life of your output transformer.

I would advise against the WAZA if you are playing an expensive amp, especially if its a vintage Boogie.
JP-2C Limited Edition, Nr. 274 of 325
2C+ modded Studio Preamp
Mark V:25 -RETURNED

https://www.instagram.com/p/CM0U_Z8JNxT ... 52f3rlq8gd

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