G-System?????

I don't know why, that's why I'm asking.

So, if I understand correctly, I will need to use a ballance to un-ballance converter at the amp end but the G has ballanced outs if I use a TRS cable?

No need for a converter. Just regular TRS to TRS. The extra wire actually terminates at the send and receive ends of the G System. You won't need any special converters or equipment.

Peace,
Joshua

From everything I've read on the White Pages and reviews, I would need to convert the signal from ballanced to unballanced at my amp.

I have a DC-5 and a DC-3.
Both are really great amps, but tend to suffer from ground loop hum when using the 4 cable method and a pedal board.
Plus, the G-Sys will have a 5th cable connected to the Footswitch In jack on my amp.
5 20' cables are bound to make some noise!

Monsta-Tone said:

From everything I've read on the White Pages and reviews, I would need to convert the signal from ballanced to unballanced at my amp.

I have a DC-5 and a DC-3.
Both are really great amps, but tend to suffer from ground loop hum when using the 4 cable method and a pedal board.
Plus, the G-Sys will have a 5th cable connected to the Footswitch In jack on my amp.
5 20' cables are bound to make some noise!

Click to expand...

The ebtech HE 2 is a 2 channel unit that costs about 60 bucks, it'll eliminate hum caused by ground loops as well as automatically convert trs to ts. I have 2 of these and everything coming out of the G is trs, everything going to the amp is ts.

joeydego said:

Personally, I use and see a benefit in using trs cables thru ebtechs. Just because you don't have noise in the first 9 venues doesn't mean you shouldn't be protected from noise in the 10th. Nothing more amaturish that steady buzz. For the negligible cost after spending 3 grand on effects and a head, seems to be a no brainer. Read the white paper (Google g system white paper). You can't go wrong if you follow Lairds advice on all things G. Another good read is Scot Kahn's book, Modern Guitar Rigs.

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Lairds book is a good starting point, but I felt he got hung up details and took his eye off the big picture.

Long story short, I felt he put in an extraordinary amount of effort and expense to produce a result that was inferior to a using a bunch of short patch cables. Both in terms of the sonics due to introducing more noise and electronics into the signal path and in terms of reliability due to introducing more components into the guitar rig.

But, this is only my opinion. Some people really want the brain on their pedalboard, and for those guys the added stuff is obviously worth it. For me it was easier to rack everything (Korg DTR-1000, Furman power conditioner, G-System and a Maxon OD808) and set it on the amp. I never had any ground loop issues, but I never tried running to a second amp.

screamingdaisy said:

joeydego said:

Personally, I use and see a benefit in using trs cables thru ebtechs. Just because you don't have noise in the first 9 venues doesn't mean you shouldn't be protected from noise in the 10th. Nothing more amaturish that steady buzz. For the negligible cost after spending 3 grand on effects and a head, seems to be a no brainer. Read the white paper (Google g system white paper). You can't go wrong if you follow Lairds advice on all things G. Another good read is Scot Kahn's book, Modern Guitar Rigs.

Click to expand...

Lairds book is a good starting point, but I felt he got hung up details and took his eye off the big picture.

Long story short, I felt he put in an extraordinary amount of effort and expense to produce a result that was inferior to a using a bunch of short patch cables. Both in terms of the sonics due to introducing more noise and electronics into the signal path and in terms of reliability due to introducing more components into the guitar rig.

But, this is only my opinion. Some people really want the brain on their pedalboard, and for those guys the added stuff is obviously worth it. For me it was easier to rack everything (Korg DTR-1000, Furman power conditioner, G-System and a Maxon OD808) and set it on the amp. I never had any ground loop issues, but I never tried running to a second amp.

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Absolutely agree. Laird also has a few things in the white pages that border on opinion more than fact. I honestly say to buy the G System, wire it up, and see how much noise there is. If the noise is too much then start spending the cash on cables and stuff. You may find that your setup is absolutely silent with no special stuff. You may also find it is easier to rack the brain than run 80 feet of cable with half of it being special cable.

Peace,
Joshua

screamingdaisy said:

TRS/Balanced cables will only produce a result if it's connected into a balanced input/output on both ends. Your amp's inputs/outputs are unbalanced, ...

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You are correct. I used TRS cabling to connect my G-Major 2 in between my Triaxis and my 2:90, as the G-Major 2 also has balanced in/out. I ran each side of the 2:90 into a single 12" driver in a 2x12, then spent quite some time trying to figure out why I had no low end. A switch to regular TS cables confirmed it; phase reversal. The balanced aspect of the G-Major 2 does this if you use TRS cables. If you connect another device that uses balanced, the phases end up correct in the end, but neither the Triaxis nor the 2:90 are balanced. If running only a single channel, this would never be noticed, but a stereo setup using TRS where not supported doesn't work.

I had no noise at all with regular cables. Until I ditched my cheapo 65 dollar furman for a P1800AR. Instant buzz. One HE2 corrected it. Keep in mind, you can hook your stuff up and it'll be dead quiet. Any little change in power or location or moving a piece of gear can cause a ground problem. HE2's, after spending a couple grand on a head and effects to me are cheap enough they're a must have. YMMV.

Thanks for all of the info guys!

I tried the TC forum, but that place is dead at times. I have posted questions in the past and not received 1 answer until 2 years later!

I just paid for one that I found on CL here in Hawaii.
Should be here by Wednesday!
I will be keeping the brain in the footswitch. Not sure I want to carry around a rack, amp, external cab, pedalboard, and guitars.
Gotta keep it simple.
If I have hum issues, I will address them after I've tried it for a while. I live on Maui and the power distribution is pretty much the worst I have ever seen! I've been an electrician for over 20 years, I've seen some shitty power, but this is just the worst!

So...
All cable, hum, ground questions aside....I have some other questions.

Loops?
I am thinking that I would like to use a few dirt pedals and maybe a super high gain distortion pedal, for different tones.
Is there any popping, delay, etc. when using a distortion or overdrive pedal in the loops? These will be going into the front of the amp.

Graphic EQ
The Graphic EQ on my amp is just before the FX loop. I use it for a solo boost.
I do not want to use the attenuation style "Boost" that the G has. Just doesn't sound that great to me.
Will I cause clipping in the input buffers of the G Sys if I use my Graphic EQ as a boost? I generally set the bass sliders in the middle and just boost the mids and treble slightly. Not enough to make a drastic difference, but enough to get a little more sustain and make the notes louder/cut through better.

Expression Pedals
- What are you guys using for an expression pedal? I would like something that works very well and is sturdy, but I also want something that is small.
I bought a Boss expression/volume pedal from AMS and immediately sent it back once I realized it was so freakishly huge!
- How hard is it to program the expression pedal into the G-Sys? Or should I ask how hard it is to calibrate the pedal to the G?

Toggle?
Can the preset buttons on the G be programmed so that they will toggle between the preset that is assigned to the button and the previous preset?
Years ago, I had a Rolls midi pedal. It was super rugged, super cheap, and had almost no functions that I could change.
The thing I liked about it though was the fact that it would automatically toggle between the preset assigned to it and the previous preset. Really cut down on the tap dancing!


You guys have been really great! I feel like I should be buying a round of Newcastle right now for everyone!
Thank you.

No pops or clicks with the loops, never used the EQ, Ernie Ball volume pedals with y cables, not sure i understand the last one.

Peace,
Joshua

Say you are playing a song with lots of clean and heavy parts.
You are only using 2 presets.
Do you have to preset the button for each preset when you want to change them, or can you program the buttons to go back to the previous preset?

Monsta-Tone said:

Say you are playing a song with lots of clean and heavy parts.
You are only using 2 presets.
Do you have to preset the button for each preset when you want to change them, or can you program the buttons to go back to the previous preset?

Click to expand...

Not too clear on what you're asking. I'll describe what I do, hope it helps. My amp is 3 channels (triple rec). I have my 3 meat and potato sounds in bank 1,2, and 3 for each channel. When I step on 2, it switches the amp to the middle channel, same with 1 goes to clean and 3 goes to 3. I have other song specific presets but I'm on these 3 90% of the night. If I need to go clean to heavy, its just a matter of stepping on bank 2 to get me to my heavy sound. To go to clean, I then step on bank 1. Loops are instant and noiseless. Any attenuation from your guitar will cause a need for adjustment input level. The eq from the amp, not sure if that'll cause you to hit the loop harder. Last thing, I assigned the G sys boost button to activate the solo function of the head, the boost on the g is locked off.

Similar thing for me.

Bank 1
1) Clean w/ light delay
2) Clean w/ thick chorus and delay
3) Dry rhythm
4) Lead with slapback delay
5) Lead with compressor and long delay
Boost - triggers solo boost on amp.

Bank 2
1) Clean w/ reverb
2) Dry rhythm
3) Dry lead

I had an OD808 in one of the loops but I preferred using the built in compressor instead.

screamingdaisy said:

Similar thing for me.

Bank 1
1) Clean w/ light delay
2) Clean w/ thick chorus and delay
3) Dry rhythm
4) Lead with slapback delay
5) Lead with compressor and long delay
Boost - triggers solo boost on amp.

Bank 2
1) Clean w/ reverb
2) Dry rhythm
3) Dry lead

I had an OD808 in one of the loops but I preferred using the built in compressor instead.

Click to expand...

I gave away my dyna comp and tremonti wah, the G blows both out of the water. Even the auto wah on the g sounds better than that one I had did.

joeydego said:

I gave away my dyna comp and tremonti wah, the G blows both out of the water. Even the auto wah on the g sounds better than that one I had did.

Click to expand...

Interesting. I haven't messed with the G-Systems wah yet. Despite liking digital for delay and modulation I still have a bias against it for other things and thus I just kind of assumed a digital wah would sound like crap.

Sounds like I need to get an expression pedal and start experimenting. :lol:

The wah from the 1st song in my signature line on my site, Peaches and Creme, is the G's auto wah. (Gibson LP custom and a triple rec, tube screamer up front as well).

So.....
I have pretty much set all of my levels and have a few more questions.....

1. When you set your loop levels (according to page 34 of the White Pages), do you pay attention to the clip meter on the front of the G, or do you just use your ears?
- I used the clip meter (when the LED turned red, I turned the channel Master volume down a bit).
- I noticed a little bit of loss in tone. I am guessing that this is because I am not pushing the inputs on the G and the power amp of my DC as much.

2. Should I just use my ears and not worry about the red LED?
- I noticed that when I plugged my guitar into the input of the G and used the 4 cable method, that the input LED's only go half way up, so I am nowhere near clipping. I'm thinking that I can go a little bit hotter with the channel Master volumes.

3. Did any of you guys end up having to use the Ebtech Line Level Shifter to keep your amp from clipping the Loop?

4. What are your settings in the Global Levels Menu?

5. What are you guys using for a Solo boost?
- My amp does not have the Solo function from the factory, although I could easily add it.
- I have been using my GEQ for a solo boost, but was afraid that I would run into clipping issues if I used it like this with the G.
- Also, I have started using the GEQ in the "V" setting, and really like the results, so I want to keep that there.
- I tried the Solo boost function with the G, but don't really like the tone when the Solo is not engaged because it just attenuates the normal tone.

You guys have been great! I post things on the TC forum and nobody ever replies.

This may sound odd, but your ears are a really poor judge of tone. They're finely attuned to hear differences in sound but net very attuned to judge quality.

Long story short, any time you turn down the volume your ears will perceive that as a reduction in tone even though it really nothing but a reduction in volume. Turn the master volume back up to compensate and your tone will magically be restored.

I hit the red all the time, but am not constantly in the red. I'm pretty sure that's fine. I think red was set conservatively in the design.

As far as boost I use the amps solo channel