Studio Preamp, a real "Mark"?

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Messerschmitt

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Going through some pretty drastic gear changes, which basically saw me sell my old Tremoverb for a Marshall Jubilee. Frankly, needed a Marshall and found out that I ultimately prefer the Mark tone to the DRec tone. While I had intended to pick up a MKV (or possibly a IV or even a IC+) down the road, I came across a great deal for a Studio Preamp. Now, I recall these getting great reviews and being thought of as the hidden gem in the M/B line, so I bought it..... By the way, planning to run this either into my old Hiwatt (straight into the front) or w/ the Jubilee (either through the loop or through the front).

So, in waiting for the Studio Preamp to arrive, I'm starting to wonder if the SP is a bonafide "Mark" amp. My research indicates that it is - and is even comparable to the IIC+. So now wondering why so cheap? I know a proper power amp is important, and there is the convenience of having an all in one unit - but seriously, these are about 1/10th the price of a IIC+ and about 1/3 to 1/2 the price of even a MKIII.

So, did I do right?
 
Hi, I guess you did right; the Studio Pre is one of the best Mark series preamp for sure, but it has it's own faults compared to Mark series amps and IMHO this is the reason it's cheaper.

the fact that this is basically a 1 channel preamp for live purpose is the main fact that would make it being so cheap, depending on the kind of music you play it will be an only 1 channel choice as it's impossible to have a crystal clean and a high gain monster lead at the same time.

I basically use one channel when live because I have this system dedicated to a cover band that plays some 80-90-00's hard rock and metal but into very high gain territory (imagine covering Led Zep and Slayer wuth the same sound lol) so I can live without this live situation versatility.

I bet you'll be very glad with your Studio Pre if you take care of it's own limitations; I browsed hard this forum for getting knowledge to tweak this beautiful preamp properly and got the right answers almost everywhere

rgz
 
It's a great preamp, but a lot of the IIC+ tone comes from the power amp as well, as Mark V owners will attest. I used mine with a 50/50 that worked really well (this was the power amp it was designed for), but I'm not sure exactly what the right IIC+ power amp would be. The 50/50 is not simul-class.

Ultimately the IIC+ has "collector" value, while the SP does not. Most people with IIC+ amps are not gigging them. If they didn't record MOP with them, I doubt the IIC+ would be any more value than a IIB or a IV.
 
The Studio pre is awesome. I use mine with a Mesa Simul-stereo 295 but it sounds great through my 1972 Marshall 100 watt head and the best sound I ever got with it was when I used it with my Mark llB through the front input jack. Actually that is the best tone I ever had in my life. I have no problem using both the clean channel and the lead channel. I have absolutely no use for sparkly clean cleans because of the style of my playing, but I get a great cleans with the volume turned down on my guitar. I have found that coming out of the effect send is less compressed sounding than coming out of the standard outputs. With my Mark lll's I always use the GEQ, it doesn't sound right with out it, whereas with the studio pre, I get such great tone with out the GEQ I use the GEQ as a lead boost. Presently, this week anyway, my studio pre/295 rig is my #1 amp for performance purposes because it has more tonal flexibility than my other amps. I got unbelievable deals on my gear because I check CL everyday and snatch up the Mesa deals. My SP/295 set-up cost $550.00, which is more than I paid for my Mark lll's, but well worth every penny I paid.
 
elvis said:
If they didn't record MOP with them, I doubt the IIC+ would be any more value than a IIB or a IV.

Or a lot of early Dream Theater albums and probably a dickload of other albums, it's not just MoP :)

IIRC the Studio can be modded to IIC+ specs, correct? Or is that the Quad?
 
THC_4_ONE said:
it will be an only 1 channel choice as it's impossible to have a crystal clean and a high gain monster lead at the same time.

It was comments like this one that led me to buy the Quad preamp instead of the Studio preamp. Now I wish I had just bought the studio preamp instead and here is why:

First, I find myself using ONLY channel 1 of the quad preamp (which is basically the same as the studio preamp) 99% of the time. In fact, I can get an AMAZING clean sound.. AND an AMAZING lead sound, out of channel 1 of the quad preamp... with just a click of the footswitch... which SHOULD mean that this is true of the studio preamp, too.

the key is what kind of sound you're looking for. This may be due to my lack of knowledge/ability... but channel 1 of my quad preamp (which, again is equiv to a studio preamp) to me is a two-trick pony.. but it does two amazing tricks:

(1) amazing sparkling clean and full bodied clean sound... I don't think this can be improved upon

(2) amazing lead sound... probably not appropriate for things like "death metal"... but more like 80s metal sounds like Night Ranger, RATT, etc. (or Carlos Santana) that kind of clean-sounding and sweet overdrive that doesn't sound muddy and gross.

And those are really the only two sounds I ever wanted (besides things I do with effects).

And you CAN get BOTH of those with a studio preamp WITHOUT compromising either one.... and WITHOUT getting into a situation where your lead or clean sound isn't as good because you needed a knob turned a certain way to help the other sound better.

here are some things I did with my Quad Preamp (that should translate to the studio).. again, using ONLY channel 1:

(1) Make sure your clean sound is SUPER CLEAN.. without ANY hint of crunch in it. not only does this sound better.. but it will make your overdrive sound better. otherwise, you'll have mud in your overdrive sound (but notice I didn't say toneless!)

(2) the preamp needs a petal that boosts the gain going into the amp... just a little. This is mentioned in several places on this board.. but I do that a little differently... as Ill explain in a moment

(3) I find that the reverb SUCKS.. there, I said it. Maybe it is just the reverb on my unit? But I really think that vintage spring reverb adds lots of noise and cuts out some tone. So I just use reverb/delay from my effects rack.

(4) The EQ... AND some of the knob pullouts (bright, etc)... improve the sound/tone, but unfortunately not without adding just a hint of noise. So I now don't even use the EQ, and what I've done is "kill two birds with one stone" by using a Tone Job effects petal to accomplish TWO things: be that extra boost mentioned in (2), AND provide a little EQ to compensate for not using the built in EQ.

(5) various volume knobs feed into one another like an assembly line. Avoid situations where the volume is too high at one stage, then "choked" at the next stage.. as that can in some situations cause "mud".

What is crazy.. is that when I was first getting used to the quad, but didn't know much about it, I was getting some raunchy sounds that were WORSE than a cheap $50 distortion petal. I remember sweating profusely as I wondered if I had spent all that time and money on something that would never sound better than a cheap $50 distortion petal.

But after some tweaking... it sounds amazing!

NOTE: Channel 2 on the quad has a good clean sound, but not as good as channel 1's clean sound. Channel 2's lead sound is more like a George Thorogood "bad to the bone" sound... but not even particularly good at it... while again, in contrast, Channel 1's lead sound is amazing--which is what you should get with the studio preamp since the studio preamp is channel 1 of the quad preamp.

PS - coincidentally, I've had my quad for about a year, and I just encountered a technical problem... maybe a blown tube?... but otherwise, I hope everything I said above will help you!
EDIT: Yes, it was a bad tube. After replacing that, it sounds amazing again!

Rob
 
Hi invaluement, I'm sorry I didn't explain it accurately, as I play Death Metal and so this is the reason for me to state this is only one channel preamp for my own use as I use a LOT of distortion pushed with a Klon Centaur and a Keeley Compressor c4 so I get clipping my clean channel too early and it gets unuseful for a crystal clean purpose, I'm aware I can get both channels working good at the same time but as I've said NOT into the "High gain monster" territory, of course you can use both when talking about 80s shred sounds, although some decent early thrash metal.....

Cheers
 
invaluement said:
THC_4_ONE said:
it will be an only 1 channel choice as it's impossible to have a crystal clean and a high gain monster lead at the same time.

It was comments like this one that led me to buy the Quad preamp instead of the Studio preamp. Now I wish I had just bought the studio preamp instead and here is why:

First, I find myself using ONLY channel 1 of the quad preamp (which is basically the same as the studio preamp) 99% of the time. In fact, I can get an AMAZING clean sound.. AND an AMAZING lead sound, out of channel 1 of the quad preamp... with just a click of the footswitch... which SHOULD mean that this is true of the studio preamp, too.

the key is what kind of sound you're looking for. This may be due to my lack of knowledge/ability... but channel 1 of my quad preamp (which, again is equiv to a studio preamp) to me is a two-trick pony.. but it does two amazing tricks:

(1) amazing sparkling clean and full bodied clean sound... I don't think this can be improved upon

(2) amazing lead sound... probably not appropriate for things like "death metal"... but more like 80s metal sounds like Night Ranger, RATT, etc. (or Carlos Santana) that kind of clean-sounding and sweet overdrive that doesn't sound muddy and gross.

And those are really the only two sounds I ever wanted (besides things I do with effects).

And you CAN get BOTH of those with a studio preamp WITHOUT compromising either one.... and WITHOUT getting into a situation where your lead or clean sound isn't as good because you needed a knob turned a certain way to help the other sound better.

here are some things I did with my Quad Preamp (that should translate to the studio).. again, using ONLY channel 1:

(1) Make sure your clean sound is SUPER CLEAN.. without ANY hint of crunch in it. not only does this sound better.. but it will make your overdrive sound better. otherwise, you'll have mud in your overdrive sound (but notice I didn't say toneless!)

(2) the preamp needs a petal that boosts the gain going into the amp... just a little. This is mentioned in several places on this board.. but I do that a little differently... as Ill explain in a moment

(3) I find that the reverb SUCKS.. there, I said it. Maybe it is just the reverb on my unit? But I really think that vintage spring reverb adds lots of noise and cuts out some tone. So I just use reverb/delay from my effects rack.

(4) The EQ... AND some of the knob pullouts (bright, etc)... improve the sound/tone, but unfortunately not without adding just a hint of noise. So I now don't even use the EQ, and what I've done is "kill two birds with one stone" by using a Tone Job effects petal to accomplish TWO things: be that extra boost mentioned in (2), AND provide a little EQ to compensate for not using the built in EQ.

(5) various volume knobs feed into one another like an assembly line. Avoid situations where the volume is too high at one stage, then "choked" at the next stage.. as that can in some situations cause "mud".

What is crazy.. is that when I was first getting used to the quad, but didn't know much about it, I was getting some raunchy sounds that were WORSE than a cheap $50 distortion petal. I remember sweating profusely as I wondered if I had spent all that time and money on something that would never sound better than a cheap $50 distortion petal.

But after some tweaking... it sounds amazing!

NOTE: Channel 2 on the quad has a good clean sound, but not as good as channel 1's clean sound. Channel 2's lead sound is more like a George Thorogood "bad to the bone" sound... but not even particularly good at it... while again, in contrast, Channel 1's lead sound is amazing--which is what you should get with the studio preamp since the studio preamp is channel 1 of the quad preamp.

PS - coincidentally, I've had my quad for about a year, and I just encountered a technical problem... maybe a blown tube?... but otherwise, I hope everything I said above will help you!
EDIT: Yes, it was a bad tube. After replacing that, it sounds amazing again!

Rob

what sort of settings do you use? I have set my quad up so channel 1 does my clean and my lead and channel 2 does two kinds of dirty rhythm. i started with the typical metallica type settings (on channel 1) and then reducing the gain and tweaking the mids, so my lead sound is not very gritty at all. i use an eq pedal with a slight upper-mid boost if i want a bit more saturation.
 

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