Mesa loudness: 50/50 vs 20/20

This may be a silly question though being newbbie with these 2 power amps I thought I might ask.

I've owned a 2:90 years ago and I was looking into something smaller and lighter, hence the 20/20. This unit is known for being very loud for 20/20 watts. In my eternal search for the perfect tone I just acquired a 50/50 as the 20/20 was coloring my sound in a way I didn't like, I was in the need for a tighter low end response. (Inevitably we gravitate to heavier amps)

Now that I'm comparing these 2 power amps and I get about the same loudness on the 50/50 with its volume at noon as with the 20/20 with its volume at 9 o'clock.

My question: Although I should be retubing the 50/50 as it has old tubes (but supposedly in good shape), is the difference in loudness between these 2 power amps that minimal because of the 20/20 ridiculously loud characteristic? Or is it really that the 50/50 tubes are in need of replacement? Or am I missing something here?

It is probably a combination of old tubes and different responses on the pots. With my 20/20, I've noticed the volume doesn't get louder after 10:30, but just distorts more. That leaves at least half the travel of the pot as a "distortion" knob. The 50/50 may not reach its full volume until 2:00 or later, making the knob settings deceiving.
On the tube front, it could be a 12ax7 that is supplying a lower signal to the power tubes.

Thanks for the reply, I'm going to get new tubes in any case, and since I'm new with mesa gear (except for the 2:90 which never got new tubes from me :? )

What tube brand do Mesa lovers recommend for this power amp?
I'm looking to get nice clean loud power with good low end definition as I play mostly metal and hard rock.
Should I go with Mesa or try something else? I've read good things about JJ's and winged C SED.

I could ask the same for the Studio Pre that I just picked up too, perhaps that should be another thread?

I have JJ's (that came with the amp) in my 20/20. Never got to really compare them with mesa's. I have mesa tubes in my roadster, and have never any complaints about them, and I don't expect to run into any problems with mesa tubes. That's about my personal experience with tubes.... Don't fix what ain't broke.

j4q0 said:

I could ask the same for the Studio Pre that I just picked up too, perhaps that should be another thread?

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I just put JJs in my Studio Preamp, they work fine.
I also put Tung-Sols in my 50 Caliber and the distortion sounds more aggressive.
I think the JJs were about $10 each and the Tung-Sols were $15.

j4q0 said:

Thanks for the reply, I'm going to get new tubes in any case, and since I'm new with mesa gear (except for the 2:90 which never got new tubes from me :? )

What tube brand do Mesa lovers recommend for this power amp?
I'm looking to get nice clean loud power with good low end definition as I play mostly metal and hard rock.
Should I go with Mesa or try something else? I've read good things about JJ's and winged C SED.

I could ask the same for the Studio Pre that I just picked up too, perhaps that should be another thread?

Click to expand...

I'm actually looking into retubing my 50-50 as well. Previous owner has some Ruby Tubes in there which I always thought sounded like *** in other amps but sound pretty good in this one. I had Sovtek WXLT+s in my Mark IV that were selected for Mesa's Bias range and they sounded pretty huge and mean.

What I've read that do not go well with the 50-50 are the 5881s. Apparently they sound very harsh in this amp because of it's upper mid characteristics.

Also, the 20-20 gets louder faster because of EL-84s more than anything. I'm not sure what Mesa does to EL-84s but it seems like they just run them flat-out straight out of the gate. I had a Nomad 45 that was like that as well, just super load at the start that never really got louder but just compressed more.

On the 50/50, to me it seems the 15 watt and 50 watt modes are about the same in volume. Just a bit more breakup on 15 watt mode and more low end in 50 watt mode. If i was an EL-84 fan, i'd probably go with the 20/20 due to space savings. Can't imagine volume being an issue with it.

A 50 watt amp is not that much louder than a 20 watter. In order to be twice as loud as a 20 watt amp, you need 200 watts, or 10 times the power.
The 50 watter will have a bit more clean headroom, and the 6L6 tubes have a more scooped tone with more low-end than the EL-84 equipped 20/20. EL-84s have the Vox sound, with more mids and earlier breakup.
However, a 50 watt amp is not going to be two-and-a-half times louder than a 20 watt amp.

What kind of cab are you running the power amp into?