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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 5:17 pm 
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Bottle Rocket

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I regularly use rosewood fingerboards and the tones from the recto are awesome, but this is not happening with my maple fingerboard guitar. Have any of you experience the same as I?, any recommendations as far as settings to work better with maple?

Just recently used mi mini recto with my new EVH maple fingerboard guitar and I was not pleased with what I was able to get from it tone wise. The sounds were not real pleasant, as you know tone is hard to describe, hard to explain. It just did not sounded right to my ears as previously using my guitars with rosewood fingerboards. Of course I did have to redial everything up from my previous set up to get something fair from my recto.

Am I missing something?, did the rectifiers are specially designed for darker woods? :(


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 5:43 pm 
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Mark IV
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sonoragazzo wrote:
I regularly use rosewood fingerboards and the tones from the recto are awesome, but this is not happening with my maple fingerboard guitar. Have any of you experience the same as I?, any recommendations as far as settings to work better with maple?

Just recently used mi mini recto with my new EVH maple fingerboard guitar and I was not pleased with what I was able to get from it tone wise. The sounds were not real pleasant, as you know tone is hard to describe, hard to explain. It just did not sounded right to my ears as previously using my guitars with rosewood fingerboards. Of course I did have to redial everything up from my previous set up to get something fair from my recto.

Am I missing something?, did the rectifiers are specially designed for darker woods? :(


Pickups are going to have more of an effect than neck woods...We don't design amps around fingerboard wood ; )

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Last edited by Authorized Boogie on Tue Dec 09, 2014 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 6:28 pm 
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Dual Recto
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sonoragazzo wrote:

Am I missing something?, did the rectifiers are specially designed for darker woods? :(


Try a yellow guitar. I notice most of my amps sound better with yellow, white, or silver guitar. The brand of your guitar strap will influence the "mids" too.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 8:40 pm 
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Tongue in cheek aside, maple is noticeably brighter than Rosewood. Are you finding your tone fizzy or percussive? I prefer that, but you'll have to try messing with presence to get it more like Rosewood.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 5:46 pm 
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Bottle Rocket

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elvis wrote:
Tongue in cheek aside, maple is noticeably brighter than Rosewood. Are you finding your tone fizzy or percussive? I prefer that, but you'll have to try messing with presence to get it more like Rosewood.


Will try to play with the presence knob, thanks


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2016 3:19 pm 
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It may also help to bring the mids up. If you're playing Ash/Maple, it will be very bright, vs a mahogany guitar with rosewood that will have TONS of mids. You might also try boosting the mids in front of the amp with an EQ or Tube Screamer.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:51 am 
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If your maple fingerboard guitar has different pickups than your rosewood counterparts, I think the difference is from the pickups my friend. I bet if I blind-fold you and give you identical guitars save for the fretboards, you could not tell which was maple, rosewood, ebony, richlite etc.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 2:25 pm 
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I've already done that test. I've run a slew of guitars with the same scale and pickups. I can easily tell what the neck and body of a guitar are made of. If nobody could tell, they wouldn't be so particular about them.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 4:38 pm 
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elvis wrote:
I've already done that test. I've run a slew of guitars with the same scale and pickups. I can easily tell what the neck and body of a guitar are made of. If nobody could tell, they wouldn't be so particular about them.


I'd like to administer that test to you!

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 5:23 pm 
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You can administer it to yourself easily enough. Get a bolt-on guitar that is available with maple and rosewood. Get one of each guitar or one of each neck. Swap the necks back and forth.

Personally, I like a lot of edge to my tone. I can always throttle the attack and buzz back, but it's subtle and difficult to add. I can get brighter pickups or go maple or both. I like tonally-balanced pickups and maple. Just my preference. The edgy pickups are usually a bit thin for my taste. My experience with maple is more cut and more apparent sustain, where rosewood is softer in the highs and a bit too smooth. I like swamp ash and Alder for the same reasons, though I also have mahogany/rosewood guitars where I've changed pups for some extra bite while retaining the lows. BKP Cold Sweats work great for that.

My three main guitars are
Tom Anderson Mongrel H-H Swamp Ash/maple. Desert Island Guitar. Does heavy rock AND a dead-on tele tone with the coil taps.
PRS SC245 with BKP Cold Sweats. Fantastic guitar. Plays so well, it's worth having rosewood.
PRS Tremonti with stock pups. I use this for down-tuning (usually drop-Db). The overly-bright bridge pup sounds TERRIBLE tuned to E-standard with 0.010, but cuts nicely while retaining some meat with 0.011 tuned down.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:31 pm 
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elvis wrote:
I've already done that test. I've run a slew of guitars with the same scale and pickups. I can easily tell what the neck and body of a guitar are made of. If nobody could tell, they wouldn't be so particular about them.

If you ran the test by yourself where you knew beforehand which necks you were testing and not in a blind or double blind fashion, I'll suggest that you were heavily influenced by confirmation bias. In a true, double-blind test most players could not tell the difference in tone from one type of fingerboard to the next with any degree of measurable certainty. Playing with more gain/OD, the degree of certainty gets worse. There was a test done with top concert violinists who, when blindfolded, could not tell the difference between a real Stradivarius and a well-crafted copy. There's a lot of other objective data out there that, if not debunks, at least calls into question the sacred nature of "tone woods."

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:17 pm 
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Mark III

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elvis says what he knows. His posts are intelligent and insightful. If he says he can easily tell a difference, I belive him.

Violins made to sound as close as possible to a Stradivarius is very different from guitars that are made of different woods trying, in part, to sound different.

From my YouTube experience, this is a debate that cannot be won. :lol:

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:53 pm 
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I agree with both of you.

Yes, there is almost certainly some confirmation bias for me. However, I can also say for sure that OTHER people in my band who knew nothing about the guitars I was playing (other than color) had significant preferences for one over another. So they were essentially blind-tested.

Also, I have been able to listen to recordings and predict which guitars were used, and then confirm by reading interviews or looking at studio notes.

IMO it's not nearly so subtle as you suggest. Again, why would there be so many woods available if not for significant preference? I first noticed this when I switched from an Ibanez 540S to an IDENTICAL 540S except that the first had rosewood and the second a maple board. Suddenly I was much closer to EVH tone. I owned both at the same time and could switch back and forth and found a HUGE difference in the attack and "bite". Again, I recommend that you try this for yourself.

And I agree that this debate will never be won.

Thanks for the kind words, SamuelJ!

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 10:58 am 
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Mark I

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Just to jump into the fray:

TL;DR version: You have different guitars and their sounds differ. That is normal. If you want to figure out why they sound different, look at the pickups first, not the fret board material.


I'm not sure how many of you have been into the Mesa Boogie building. I had a good friend who worked there for 20 years, and I would pop in regularly and go to lunch with him. He would often bring me inside and show me around, or just take me to his desk, while he finished up. During my visits, there was pretty much ALWAYS someone playing a guitar, testing amps.

To imagine the number of guitar and amp configurations that get used in that building on a regular basis everyday for years on end is astounding. When a representative from that company comes in and minimizes how much neck woods alone affect tone across different guitars, I would place a lot of stock in that assertion.

My personal experience, as someone who has owned over 40 guitars, is that I can't tell much of a difference between recorded guitars, especially distorted guitars. With clean tones, I can tell the difference between pickups much easier.

How a guitar feels is an entirely different matter. I do have a preference for the feel of Ebony fret boards, then Rosewood, then Maple, which I do not especially care for. My aesthetic taste follows in the same order, which I'm sure has nothing to do with my bias :mrgreen:

I will acknowledge that it is possible that rare individuals can perceive the tonal differences. It is just not the most likely scenario when no good, objective tests have been done. If you look up the Audiophile contests that no one can seem to win, the Wine "Experts" unable to sort $100 bottles from $10 bottles or who will find huge differences in quality between different labels that turn out to be the same wine.

The reason there are so many choices is that people have different tastes in appearance, feel and sound. Between marketing and the legends, beliefs have been built up, and whether they are true or not, it affects our perception. It's like the people who will swear that there is a difference in sound or image quality with high end HDMI cables. They believed there was a difference, so they heard one.

Watching the fanatics in the Axe FX forums lose their minds when someone does a blind test and no one can figure out which one is the Axe FX is pretty hilarious.

None of this should be construed to mean that Elvis cannot hear the difference. Maybe he can. Sometimes the hoof beats you hear are Zebras, not horses.... but when Occam's Razor is applied, taking into account all that we know about bias and human perception, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof and we don't have that.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:21 pm 
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Mark III

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Icarusuki wrote:
To imagine the number of guitar and amp configurations that get used in that building on a regular basis everyday for years on end is astounding. When a representative from that company comes in and minimizes how much neck woods alone affect tone across different guitars, I would place a lot of stock in that assertion.


Just for arguments sake, I would like to point out that some of the mesa amp manuals I've been reading have made suggestions about settings taking wood into account. For example; in the JP2C manual it talks about using the presence control a certain way for mahogany guitars. I'm sure Doug West wrote that, and to your point, he has definitely tested and played some gear in his day.

I hope we can have a peaceful conversation here lol :lol: I agree with Authorized Boogies assertion, they are not designing amps around wood. But that's not to say wood doesn't play a part in the sound.
And I agree, it's small difference if at all, but for some people it can be a deal breaker, swearing by certain woods. As elvis said; why would people be so particular

:P

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