OD and noise gate for Nomad 55 112

Hello,

I have just registered so please be kind

This year I bought my first valve amp, a second hand Mesa Nomad 55 112. I must say that I love the tones on this amp. The clean channel is great although I mostly use channel 3 as I play in a heavy band. The sounds are great and I find it competes well against my bandmates Engl Powerball, but there is just somerthing missing for it to be great. I know it is not suppose to be a metal amp, but I just couldn´t resist when it came up for sale locally. Anyway, long story short, what I want is a tighter more defined chug on the palm mutes. I have tried pushing the preamp with the master volume on channle 3, but past a certain point I just get awful feedback. So:-

1. If I were to get a noise gate in the loop, would I be able to push the master volume to a point that will give me that tighter chug? What budget noise gate would you recommend (bearing in mind I live in Europe so probably there are a few brands we don´t have here)? It has to be budget as I bought the amp in January and a new Jackson RR5 2 months ago, and the wife almost divorced me lol

2. Or would I maybe need an overdrive pedal? What overdrive pedals can you recommend that go well with the Nomad to achieve that chug?

I would also appreciate any heavy settings anybody may have that I could try out.

Alot to ask I know, but I am a noob and maybe buying my first valve amp with so many buttons was not a great idea, but I love it

FWIW here's my 2 cents. For a good tight chug on ch.3 (or ch.2) I never turn the gain past noon. I hit the front of it with a pedal to keep it tight. It responds excellent. I use several different pedal models in my pod500. I've also used the real ones too. The pod is just way more convenient. For scooped metal I use a Rat. Keep the gain on the low side and push the amp with volume. For more mid rangey metal (80's) I use a tube screamer type. Dial up the gain to your taste. For more versatility you can add an eq to the loop. I used a modded boss 7 band. The more presence you add the more crunch you'll get but it can get too bright, thus the eq to add more bottom. Higher output pickups actually mush things out for me so I pad my JB down and that adds clarity. Hope this helps. Another thing - dial up the master it tightens up at about noon to 2 o'clock. You'll have to turn down the channel volumes though. OR NOT :twisted:

Thanks for the reply and what looks to be useful info.

When you say for scooped you use a rat, are you meaning this one?:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ProCo-RAT-II-2-distortion-overdrive-pedal-Made-in-USA-/330798598091?pt=UK_Guitar_Accessories&hash=item4d052207cb#ht_366wt_1213

What setings would you use on the amp and the pedal to get a nice chugga modern sound? And what do you mean you pad your JB down? I have the same seymour JB in my jackson.

What about noise gates? Do you get bad feedback if you try and turn the channel´s master volume up? Could I have a bad tube or something?

Cheers

Yea that's the same one I have. To get as clean a boost as possible you have to keep the distortion knob real low, almost off. I would turn it up just enough to hear smidgen of distortion, then use the volume to hit the amp. The filter knob works like a backwards treble boost. More when set low, less when up. The trick is to play around with blending the "flavors" of what the pedal and amp has to offer. Spend some time mixing the treble and presence and filter knob to get the right kind of attack and crunch. Mix the amps gain knob with the distortion knob and volume knob on the pedal.
Yea it's more work but it also will give you a better understanding of how the frequencies define certain tones. Scooping out the mids gives a chugga metal sound but it also can get lost in the mix. Turning the filter knob clockwise adds back some fatness but softens the attack. Try the same with ch.2. It can be equally amazing.
Oh yeah,a noise gate is probably a good idea too. I do use one.

Hey man, thanks for the tips. I am going to try and get the noise gate first as I get the feeling that by cranking the channel volume on channel 3 I might get to here I want to be. I tried it at rehearsal last week and I could hear some good grunt, but there was so much bloody feedback I had to back off the volume. I also have a rat eyed up second hand here in Spain so it looks like I could be on the road the good chugga :twisted:

Cheers for all the advice.

Like most amps in the 55 watt range the Nomads don't start getting punchy and full until it hurts your ears in the bedroom. At gig levels with different stomp boxes and some crafty eq-ing it's a monster of an amp. I've used mine in several different cover bands from classic rock to modern metal.

I have just discovered something pretty cool. At home I have an Arion Tube Mani MDI-1 pedal that I bought back at the beginning of the 90´s when I was a kid, that never really got used. It is still knocking around the house after 20 years. Anyway, I found a webpage the other day that basically said that pedal is a Clone of the Proco Rat So cool, I have the pedal to push and only need to find a pedal to control the feedback etc. now. I am looking at putting an ISP decimator or similar in the effects loop, to see if that will calm the beast :lol:

There you go. Never tried the gate in the loop. It's always out front. Don't know if it will work in the loop of the Nomad since it's a parallel type loop. You can always mod the loop though to make it serial. I did or else my pod would have been useless for delays and reverb and other stuff I use. There's a mod thread in case you want to do that.
Oops forgot to answer your pad question. What that means is to shave off a little of the input signal coming from your pickup. In my case the JB was hitting my effects unit input too hard and adding distortion in before I wanted it there. So I dropped the input a few db by using a pad switch on the unit. It added some clarity to the JB at full volume on the guitars knob. You can accomplish the same thing by lowering the height on your pickup or by putting a volume pedal before your effects. It's a matter of personal taste and fine tuning things to please my own ears YMMV.

If it has the stock Mesa 6L6 STR440's (I think...??) they don't have the bass oomph that something like a SED Winged C 6L6 has. Big difference from the power tubes in that amp. Also, you may want to check out something like the Celestion G12K100 speaker, marketed as having lots of tight low end representation, and by some websamples, seems to have a voicing that would also work great with Ch1 and Ch2. I'll be giving one a whirl someday if I get sick of my Heartbreaker...not likely, but thought I'd through out these ideas from my experience with my own Nomad.

Also, if you ever want to go back to classic tones, Ch2 at about 10:30 on the gain is the ticket, and use an OCD to drive it into crunch heaven.

earachemyeye, thatnks for all your info. I am trying to get a noise gate sorted out now as the last time I tried the OD pedal I have on the Mesa, I think the guys in the industrial unit next door thought I was torturing cats :lol: I also think I am going to change the height of the pickup aswell.

Tommy_G, yes, the tubes are mesa tubes. When they atart to fade I will get some of the ones you suggest to try out. Regarding the speaker, I would rather not change that out of the amp as I understand the black shadow to be a pretty good speaker. What I had thought was to make a 1x12 extension cabinet with a Vintage 30 speaker. I would prefer to buy an extension cab (I´d like a MEsa one) but money is pretty tight. How do the vintage 30 sounds "blend" with the black shadow?

Cheers

Hello again,

I could do with some further help. I finally got a Boss NS-2 pedal to try and cut out the noise and tonight I have finally managed to get to the rehearsal space to try it out....with mixed results. I got the Boss NS-2 because of the ability to have it acting up front and in the loop at the same time. So I set it up as follows:-

Guitar to Boss NS-2 Input
FX Loop send to Boss NS-2 Return
Boss NS-2 output to FX Loop Return
Boss Ns-2 Send to Input of Arion Tube Mania pedal (RAT clone)
Arion Tube mania Output to Amp input

The levels were then set as follows on the pedals:-

Arion tube mania - level at Max, distortion at 1, tone at 5
Boss NS-2 - Threshold on Max, Decya on Max, mode set to mute
FX Loop set to 100%

I tried this on channel 3, modern voicing, and can´t seem to get anything other than that "flubby" not tight chug at all. It almost sounds too "clean" and airy and not compressed.

I then tried on channel 2 and got a sound closer to what I am looking for, but still lacking that defined chug I am looking for.

If anyone can help me with settings for the amp (particularly channel 3 as this is supposed to be the heavy channel) or maybe a different chain setp for the pedals I would be grateful.

Cheers guys

I'm not sure why you would want to run a gate in the effects loop. The loop being a parallel type and not a serial loop could cause issues since a part of the signal is always fed back in even at 100% wet. I would either mod the loop to serial or take the gate out of it.
Too much clean sound could mean you need to dial back the pedal volume some and turn up the gain on the amp channel. I never set mine past 11 o'clock on the amp.. You could also dial up more distortion on the pedal if what it's giving is too clean.
Where is you're bass set on the amp? Too much and it will get flubby.
If you need a more compressed sound to tighten the attack add a compressor. It's a good pedal to have anyway. Someone says "that's tight enough sounding" another person thinks "it's not tight enough". Kinda hard to tell what you might perceive as tight. Perhaps the RAT style is to open sounding for your tastes. A Tube Screamer type pedal also gives a more compressed sound but has a mid spike. You may or may not like that.

If you can borrow a BBE sonic maximizer, try one in the loop. It's a 1u rack unit and it's actually stereo, but you only need one side. This device seems to fill out the sound with extra low frequencies and and bright presence, without sounding loose or flubby. I used it for a metal sound with my Nomad 45 for a while. Give it a go. Bring your amp to the music shop and try it out. You may not need the OD/distortion pedal with this device.

Good luck and happy hunting

Hello,

Well I have put the noise gate in the loop because the amp is giving alot of feedback. If I crank the volume and/or the master on channel 3 it starts screaming like a *****, even with the guitar volume off. I can move away from the amp and turn in any direction and it just won´t stop screaming. Therefore I got the Boss NS-2 primarily for reducing this noise of cranking the amp rather than any other noise that could be caused by the guitar and signal going in. I´ll see if I can upload some photos later on of the setup so maybe you can give me some advice on the settings.

Cheers

Mark

Ok typically my settings on ch.3 go like this. Ch. gain = 9 o'clock - 11, Ch. master =9 to 11 o'clock (modern), Presence= 9 o'clock -2, Treble= 1'oclock, Mid= 9'oclock -11, Bass= 1 o'clock -3. Amp master = 9 o'clock to noon (noon is pretty darn loud). If I'm standing right on top of the amp it will howl otherwise mine doesn't and yours shouldn't either. You may have a microphonic tube or pickup. I've never cranked the master on either the ch. or amp master. Never needed to. I use my gate to control the hiss that comes with lots of gain. It's annoying.

Thanks earachemyeye for the settings. I will see if I can try them this week at band practice.

I have been using channel 2 in the mean time and I got one band practice that it sounded superb then at the next with what I thought were the same settings I was back to that rather fragile sound on palm mutes. I have seen people on the internet saying that the Nomad gives a fizzy/buzzsaw distortion. The problem for me is that mine doesn´t, even with the gain cranked to stupid settings I don´t get any fizzy distortion at all, which I would actually prefer.

Anyway, I am going to keep struggling with my Nomad. Maybe I will get a retube kit for higher gain, and possibly change my Rat clone for a better OD or tube screamer type pedal.