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PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 6:18 pm 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
I have an old set of reds I pulled out of the RA100 when I bought it (used). The tubes look it as well (used). They still work and I had used them in a pinch when I thought I killed the Mark V (once and for all, :P but it powered back up with those in the sockets, the amp when totally dead with the 6L6 tubes. It was a rectifier tube that shorted out so at least one way to step on the caterpillar is with a bit of patience and do it real slow. (thought that was better than the usual "skin the cat").

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 6:59 am 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
I had though of an ideal rig with the TC series amps, something of the we/dry/wet using two tc-50 and one tc-100. Sure I could get a 2:50 or 2:90 and be done and save some money in the long run. If I was on the rack I would do so without question. However, there seems to be some merit using two or more amps each having a slight difference or major difference in their tone. Having more than one TC can be ideal as one footswitch can be used to control two or more amps of the same series. I did try out the daisy chaining of the two TC amps. That worked out great, no pedal fest to deal with when changing channels. Also the TC-50 and TC-100 are different in their fundamental tone. Yes they are similar but yet different. Now more to the point of why I will not go the stereo power amp way but does not mean I cannot do so if I am using different amps for the effect. (a note on the ping issue, I called Mesa tech and they want me to send a short video of the occurrence. Will have to do that tonight or over the weekend. At the moment I am a bit reluctant to remove the tubes I installed into V3 and V4 but I am curious if the ping noise is still and issue now that I have more time on the amp. For the rig idea to change into something different may require a midi controller to make it work since the JP-2C does not use the same commands as the TC-100 or TC-50. Bummer. I have discovered my ideal tone using the TC-100 and the JP-2C. :shock: Both amps have similar characteristics but they differ enough to provide a really impressive tone when running in parallel. Not exactly sure how much influence one or the other had since I was relatively close to both when I did the experiment. In a live setting, the amp will influence the guitar either with feedback or may have that enhancement or degradation of harmonics. (Roadster works against you especially in Modern voice on CH3 and CH4). Speed of attack, the TC-100 has a slight edge over the JP-2C but it is frequency dependent. As it seems the bottom end of the JP is pounding at the same time the TC-100 upper range of frequencies are ripping out. The combined effect of both amps is unreal. :shock: This is far more powerful than running the TC-50 with the RA100. I have discovered the tone and grind I am after for my next project. May do a sample recording of the two amps just to see how they record. This may also be the first time to use the cab clone from both and blend that with the mics that I will use on the cabs. I will have to see how the amp switcher will work vs the splitter so I can select which amp is the focal point and to blend the two together. I have no doubt that the TC-100 will cut in the mix as it may even be able to cut thought if one used the TC-100 for lead and the other using the JP-2C. It is not difficult to get the JP-2C into a brighter mode (just pull the presence control and adjust GEQ if needed) May have to couple the TC-100 with the Roadster and see what happens. For now the TC-100 paired up with the JP-2C is Mesa Boogie Heaven. (this is not for you clean style players as my focus for this experiment is for the hard rock to heavy metal style, although a few ACDC riffs sounded really good. I also tried to find the low limit on the gain setting for CH2 that would work with a low gain on the TC-100. Will have to try the clean channel in drive mode with a heavy tone dialed in. I think you can see the settings I used in the image. CH3 and CH2 sound of the TC-100 sounds equally impressive with CH2 or CH3 of the JP-2C. Note: CH2 will be in phase with the JP, CH3 is not. The splitter I am using does have a phase switch is not programmable. I wonder if a splitter or amp selector when using a combined pair has a midi controlled phase function.


Image

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 9:52 am 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
Sorry if this post has turned into a blog on the subject.
The bottom line.... If I had to choose one amp that would be a difficult task. Choosing a top amp or one I like the best would not be fair as this would be a personal preference that may not be the same as yours so no need to influence anyone to go with one amp over the other. ( :roll: :twisted: get the JP-2C , :mrgreen: no, get the TC-100 :twisted: JP! :mrgreen: TC!, dang it just get both 8) :shock: ) However I do have the following: Amps in current production: JP-2C, TC-50, TC-100 and the Mark V. Amps out of production: Royal Atlantic RA100 head and combo, and the Roadster. For starters, since this thread is on the TC-100 I will start with its predecessor the RA100. I will try to keep this related to the TC series in the 100W platform.

RA100 also has the power soak feature but this one is resistive and not reactive. It marks the power soak in dB vs wattage. The reason behind this labeling is straight forward since the RA can be switched from 100W to 50W with the power switch. So you get attenuation and tube saturation for the 100W setting as well as the 50W setting. I will have to compare the RA-100 to the TC-100 just on the power soak function to fine tune my statement. The TC-100 below the 50W setting tends to get a bit grainy or fizzy but that may be the Mesa EL34 tube characteristic. I did not care for the Mesa EL34 in the RA100 for that particular reason. The more you dial in the power soak it begins to sound flat or lacking the openness of the full power setting. Since I am not using the stock tubes in the RA, instead I have the =C= EL34 tubes and those in particular sound exceptional. Using the power soak feature of the RA combined with =C= I do not feel the tone is becoming sterile, quite the opposite. Using that amp with the 50W power is even more rewarding. Another thing about the RA to get more note definition out of the Hi gain channel is preamp tube selection. The amp does tend to saturate with the stock tubes in the preamp (this one uses V1 and V2 for the hi/lo channel). This amp may be more simplistic (and the Electra Dyne is of this formula) than that of the TC series, it is still an amp worth having. I would have an issue letting go of either the RA head or combo as they are unique in their own way.

Now for the TC-50. Why this one could not top the RA: It does actually. It retains a tight composer on all three channels that is more ideal for my style of playing. It did take me a while to understand the differences of what was known (RA) to the new design (TC). Those that already have the TC-50, keep it. It is a great amp to have. I am in debate if I prefer the TC-50 over the TC-100. The obvious difference between the two amps Is all in the power supply and OT section other than the number of power tubes. the TC-50 seems to have a bit more headroom than the TC-100 as well as a more dry and balanced tone. I fail to understand those that claim the TC-50 does not have enough bass. I think it has the right balance and bottom end influence. I have yet to get the TC-50 to sound muddy on any channel. Bottom end remains bold and tight. Compared to its bigger brother the TC-100, CH3 is a bit tricky to dial in as the same tone settings used on the TC-50 do not translate well on the TC-100. I have to dial the bass down or completely out on CH3 with the TC-100. There is a simple fix for this which is the old 1980's Mesa Chinese (Beijing) 12AX7-A tubes. I still have some good one's from my Mark III days when I was replacing preamps with the power tubes every 3 months when I was in a band back then. I think I was better guitar player than I am now as I am relearning how to play the guitar all over again (sometimes with an injury that never healed properly it is hard to do what you used too but I still have all of my fingers, slowly getting back to where I used to be but only better).

Roadster: well I have not compared it to the TC-100 yet. I have done so with the TC-50 in terms of blending the two amps. However, the TC-100 at full power is a beast to behold but needs to be dialed in properly, the same would apply to the Roadster as that too has some tricks that are not immediately apparent. Actually jumping from camp Mark to camp Rectifier was the trick as each amp in that series is quite different from each other in terms of tone setting relationships and how they effect the overall tone and characteristics of the distortion. There is so much you can do with the Roadster (just like the Road King). There is some difficulty balancing the volume levels with the Roadster if one gain channel is set to modern and the other gain channel is set to vintage or raw. Not like the Mark V where CH3 IIC+, IV, and extreme seem to retain relative volume levels between each voice, the Roadster does not. Roadster is also another worthy amp to have but it has its limits as it seems to work against you if you plan on pinching off harmonics. Trick for that is use the Vintage voice on CH3 using 50W power, you can squeeze it out but not like you can with the TC series, RA, JP or Mark V.

The Mark V: I wish this amp would retire as I am eager to see what is next. Perhaps I bought a dud, or lemon. I never had as much trouble loving and amp as much as I hate it. It is not a bad amp mind you, I feel it may not be right for me for some reasons or another. I have played though some Mark V's that were built more recently and did not hear the annoying tone I was getting with the one I bought in 2012. It does have an amazing clean channel ( unfortunately I do not like the tweed voice on this amp as it is super brittle, Roadster does a much better job ). CH2 Crunch and Mark I voices are great, CH3 needs a few changes to get the amp up to snuff with the rest. 12AT7 keeps the brittleness at bay, Removal of C39 does make it brighter but also brings out the midrange that is getting choked off. Perhaps this is not an issue with the latter builds. It is not just the tone that is the problem, what is more so problematic with this amp is the footswitch controller. I no longer use mine as it is prone to issues, Do you know how many cables I have just for the footswitch? Only one should suffice but have gone though 4 of them. Blame it on the circuit used for channel changing. It may be a cool method borrowed from long ago but using a voltage level to set an output on a LED bar graph driver chip may have its issues with stability if there is too much voltage variation or noise on the supply lines. Still this is a cool one chip solution that uses one signal line on the DIN cable. A simple 2-4 line decoder would have worked each output driving an ESD protected MOSFET. Actually I have never had any issues with the Roadster footswitch just with the Mark V. So perhaps the method is better than I think it is. What is more stable and reliable is the midi controller uses in the TC-50, TC-100 and the JP-2C. That also simplifies everything such that you no longer need the multiple jacks on the back of the amp for remote control if not using the footswitch. For some reason, I see the Mark V as a novelty amp more than an extension of your guitar. I am not saying the Mark V is bad, it is a good amp to have but Mesa has much better amps it its lineup than the 90W Mark V.

JP-2C: This amp is my top choice and by far my favorite amp to date. I favor it even over the TC-50 and the TC-100. But there is reason behind that statement. There are some similarities the JP has with all of my other amps. It has taken over for the Roadster as there are no challenges with harmonics, no imaginary dead spots at the 12th fret on the 3rd string (I believe that may be the resonant frequency of the Roadster and the phase relationship may be opposite to the input). I think the only setback on the JP-2C is the low gain levels of CH2 and CH3, very difficult to get a softer clip for vintage style of music. It can be done without external pedals as this is simply a trick you need to learn and that involves your guitar volume control. I almost want to add a switch to my guitar that reduces the output level for the softer clip and to bring out the full potential of the grind without having to touch the amp. Perhaps a volume pedal may do that too as I always wanted one for doing swells vs using the guitar volume pot. JP-2C is organic in its tone, it can be dialed in to provide a very raw character, sinister if that is a better term or rolled back to have a twist on what Classic rock would have sounded like if Marshall never made a guitar amp. Very dynamic and touch sensitive. You do not need to have a toggle switch with each position labeled to represent what the voice of the amp is in each position. Perhaps that is easier to most, flip a switch and it becomes "x" like with the Mark V. Well, in reality it does not sound like "x" it sounds like "y" and that is why I stated the Mark V is more of a novelty. As with any amp there is a learning curve. Even with simple controls like on the Electra Dyne, each control has a unique characteristic that may be quite different on another amp in a different series. I would say the JP-2C is very versatile in its tone and gain characteristics. And those two GEQ, they are very reactive and usable than on the previous Mark series amps including the Mark V (90W) and the Mesa 5BEQ pedal. Now having the TC-100 what am would I pick? that is a tough question to answer. If I were to buy another amp to pair up I think I would get another JP-2C. I almost did just that but wanted to try out the TC-100.

TC-100: In respect to what was already stated in this thread on the TC-100, this amp packs a punch. At full power it is a beast in its own way. For heavy metal I am sure it would be good for that. I did want to see how low I could go with tuning so I dropped down to a C. That sounded cool with the TC-100. I also had to try the 6 string crossover bass (short scale and plays like a standard guitar). Had to dial back the controls as I did not want to over work the amp or speakers too much. You could probably use it as a bass amp if you like your signal distorted. Not recommended though. The tight mode really makes sense for use with alternate tunings or 7 and 8 string guitars. Yeah I can see that being the norm for this amp. As for responsiveness, the amp tends to retain its gain character with rolling off of guitar volume. It does not clean up as well as the JP-2C. That may be a factor of the EL34 vs 6L6 tubes. I have yet to try the 6L6 tubes in the TC-100. That will happen eventually.

If you can afford to get either the TC-50 or the TC-100, I hope you can do so without having to sell or trade in your other amps. Sometimes there may be regret of selling what you had if it was your main amp. I had regrets selling my Mark III more so than selling the Mark IV. I sold eth Mark III not for another amp or music gear, it was because I lost all interest in playing guitar. My left arm injury has basically prevented me from enjoying the guitar let alone the severe pain just picking one up. I did get back into playing as I had made a promise to my late wife I woud continue (she heard me playing the guitar while I was preparing the Mark III for sale) When she died it was the guitar I turned too, also ended up filling a void in my life. Much of the pain is gone and I have gotten back into music with more interest, even started playing bass and the drums. I may not be very good at it but I enjoy it.

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:42 pm 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
Go figure, I put the stock tubes back into V3 and V4 and could not get the ping noise. Tried other Mesa tubes and to no avail, no ping. I was asked to send a short video of this occurrence to Mesa tech service. Oh well, amp sound great ping or no ping with the stockers in it. You do not gain much with preamp tube swaps. CH1 sounds best with the stock tubes. CH2 and CH3 seem to tighten up the bass with a change in V4 more so than V3. I was surprised to find a "like new Mesa tube from 1989". It is one of those square foil getter type made in Beijing China. Seems that the mesa tube has a bit more midrange than the one's sold by Doug's tube. You can tell with this type of tube how much use is left in it due to the discoloration between the two mica spacers. They seem to turn black in that area when they get near end of life. Hard to tell by looking at the Mesa branded JJ tubes. When I had removed the preamp tubes from my Mark IV they were 12 years old including the power tubes. I bought that amp in 2000 and did not play much, 4 years later I ripped the tendons in my left elbow and that was the end of playing for me. It still hurts to play after 14 years but I can manage.

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:34 am 
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Mark III

Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:02 pm
Posts: 152
Location: Southeast Texas
I brought a TC100 home last Tuesday. I'd post a long review about how much I love this thing, but I'm too busy enjoying the hell out of it to take the time to do much else right now

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2018 10:31 pm 
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Mark I

Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:53 pm
Posts: 40
I tried a TC-50 combo near the end of 2017 while amp hunting. Didn’t love it, especially for the money. To me, the Mark V heads (all versions: 25, 35, 90) blew it away.* Better tones all around, and much more versatile.

Last month, I plugged in to one of the new TC-100 heads on a lark and ended up bringing it home with me.

First thing I will say is this amp takes the longest to warm up of any tube amp I’ve ever played, and the contrast in tone between 3 minutes and 30 minutes is similarly wide. It doesn't go from "Hey, that sounds cool" to "Yeah, this rocks!"; it goes from “Oh, that’s nice… I guess.” to “SWEET JESUS MARY AND JOSEPH THIS IS THE WARMEST, CREAMIEST TONE I’VE EVER HEARD IN MY LIFE JUST STRIKE ME DOWN NOW LORD SO I CAN DIE HAPPY!”

OK, maybe that’s a tad hyperbolic, but I’ve played through my fair share of tube amps and have never come across such a stark difference in tone between cool and warm (by comparison, the next biggest "sonic jump" is on my Mark V, where it takes about 20 minutes before the bridge pickup on my Strat goes from "tolerable" to "singing"). I don’t know if this is a specific quirk to my amp, the EL34s, a feature of all TC-100s, or what, but it’s really worth noting. Had I been in a hurry and just toyed with the TC-100 for a few minutes, there's no way I would have ended up picking it up.

I am just loving this amp from its gritty, edge-of breakup tones on the LO channel to the hyper-saturated-yet-still-tightly-defined screaming of the HI channel. The HI channel is, well, HI gain. It's not really that complicated, but it's superb at what it does, so it doesn't need to be. LO (which is my favorite) is a bit more finicky. One quirk of the LO channel is that the tone really thins out if you push the master higher while pulling the gain lower. I still haven't figured out if this is a feature or a bug, but there's a surprising (and good) amount of sonic variation you can get just by tweaking the distance between those two knobs. If you are familiar with the Mark V, it's a bit like being able to go all the way from the "Edge" channel to the "Extreme" channel just through the master/gain knobs.

As far as CLEAN goes, I have not been blown away, but it gets the job done admirably -- and to be fair, I have explored that channel the least. Instead of investing time trying to tweak the CLEAN channel, I often find myself migrating toward other amps where I won't have to chase a great clean tone, so I reserve the right to change my opinion on the CLEAN channel in future postings.

Aside from occasionally flipping between DRIVE and NORM, I don't really use the TIGHT/NORM switches. Maybe I should? I've already got a fairly punchy sound that is accentuated by some effects pedals, so it just feels like overkill to go into TIGHT mode on the LO/HI channels.

The multi-soak thingie, I am still figuring out. In general, I've preferred the sound and persona of the amp in 100 watt mode with the global output turned down, but 3 watt mode still sounds fine just above a whisper... and I don't need headphones to play after 10pm without bugging anybody else. So far, it's mostly just 3 or 100 watt mode for home use, and 50 HI/50 LO/100 Clean for balance in rehearsals

My setup is as below. I specialize in blues and hard and/or "alternative" (whatever that means this week) rock, but play everything from (bad) jazz to (bad) progressive metal. If anybody wants to make some suggestions, they'd be welcome! Note: I'm probably one of like 17 people on the entire planet who does NOT like Mesa's V30s (they sound buzzy to me); was a teeny bit heartbroken when I tried out both the horizontal and vertical Rectifier 2x12" cabinets, as everybody told me how great the were. Have loved just about everything with the C90s in them, though.

CABINET:
Boogie Compact 1x12” Thiele Cabinet, C90 (x2)

EFFECTS:
Wampler Ego Compressor
TS808 Tube Screamer (yes, I hate myself for loving it, too. Please don’t yell at me)
MXR 108s 10-band Equalizer (if you don't get blinded by the LEDs, this is a great little tool)
MXR Phase 90
MXR M169 Carbon Copy Analog Delay Pedal

GUITARS:
Fender SSS Am Pro Stratocaster (standard V-Mod pickups)
Reverend Jetstream 390 (think Stratocaster, but with three Reverend P-90 pickups.)
Reverend Double Agent (with Railhammer Hyper Vintage bridge pickup, Reverend P-90 neck pickup)


* I've learned since then that I'm similarly not a huge fan of Mark V combos (35/90), either. Ah well!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2018 7:55 am 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
The TC series may take some time to warm up, It is not the amp exactly as it is more related to the Mesa (EHX) EL34s. Once you get the tubes cooking, the tone does open up quite a bit. The TC series seems to manage the EL34 much better than the other amps I have that can use EL34 (most of those are primarily 6L6 amps).

The trick to the clean channel is higher gain setting. If you keep it low that seems to drag the rest of the channel down with it. The same would apply to the Lo gain and Hi gain channels. The gain setting is similar to a volume control but it is setting the level early to push the cascade level into more distortion but at the same time is setting the overall volume level. The channel volume level sits late in the preamp and follows the tone stack (which is between the last two preamp stages of CH2 and CH3). Clean channel is basically the same as most Mesa amps, also this is accomplished by the clean channel having its own pair of preamp tubes unassociated with the Lo and Hi gain channel. Generally reduce the bass on the clean channel for better performance. Hi/Lo channel I usually boost the bass.

To be honest, I did nto like the TC-50 when I first tried it out at a dealership. Did not like it even after I got it home. Odd, I was not overly impressed with the JP-2C at first and the same would apply to the Roadster. Understanding the relatinship of the tone controls and how to dial in the amp made a difference. The only amp that I liked before I bought it when I tried it out was the Mark V but that did not last very long such that I started disliking it. Where is the beef? Tube rolling just was not satisfying. Now I have modified the amp on purpose just becase I did not like the overall tone of the Mark V. Minor tweaks that made a huge difference that puts it on par with my other amps that I favor the most.

The TC-100 is a bit more saturated compared to the TC-50. The 50 has a dryer tone to it which I do like, especially for palm muting. Plenty of response to harmonics and has some dynamics but the distortion level remains the same (TC-100 included) when you roll off on the guitar volume as it does not clean up as I would expect. Mark V has more dynamic resonse to that, the JP-2C has the most dynamic response in that regard (go from clean to blistering beast just by using the volume control on your guitar which gets you more involved with expression than just playing notes). I used to be one of those set the volume to max and leave it there, now I actually use it.

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 1:08 pm 
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Mark I

Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:53 pm
Posts: 40
bandit2013 wrote:
The trick to the clean channel is higher gain setting. If you keep it low that seems to drag the rest of the channel down with it. The same would apply to the Lo gain and Hi gain channels. The gain setting is similar to a volume control but it is setting the level early to push the cascade level into more distortion but at the same time is setting the overall volume level. The channel volume level sits late in the preamp and follows the tone stack (which is between the last two preamp stages of CH2 and CH3). Clean channel is basically the same as most Mesa amps, also this is accomplished by the clean channel having its own pair of preamp tubes unassociated with the Lo and Hi gain channel. Generally reduce the bass on the clean channel for better performance. Hi/Lo channel I usually boost the bass.
Yes, definitely. The LO channel in particular seems much more affected by the gain setting (for overall tone) than just about any other amp I've played, though this applies to all channels. Anybody who's fiddled with enough amps knows that gain can have a big affect on thickness, but here, things really thin out as the gain is reduced. It's not a complaint, as this can be used to create some nice effects (experiment with the soak feature here, too!), but it's something users really need to be aware of as they craft their sound. Before my Eureka moment, I spent way too much time blinking and re-checking the tone knobs on the amp and volume knobs on my guitars as the gain went up and down!

Regarding cleans, keeping what you said in mind, I've gotten the CLEAN channel past "good enough" into what I'd consider "pretty nice" territory. It does take a bit more effort to dial in the good stuff than on LO or HI, and it's a balancing act; with P-90s, I can only push the gain to a few minutes past 10 o'clock without having to dial back the volume knob on my guitar, humbuckers even less. That being said, I'm now only skeptical on the CLEAN channel as far as recording goes. For rehearsals and live performances, I've reached a point where I'm perfectly content with it.

But really, it's about those gains, isn't it? To my ears and with my setup, this snarly pig combines my favorite warm and fat 1970s overdrive with current day ubersaturation, and miraculously... somehow... it manages to avoid sounding like a steaming hot mess. I have no idea what Mesa was going for here, but for me, this simultaneously pleases both my "vintage" and "modern" sensibilities at the same time, which is pretty freakin' remarkable.

My experiences in the past with musical equipment that ventures down the "many things at once" path is that I eventually move on to more specialized tools. So the bloom will most likely fall off at some point. But for now, my only complaint with the TC-100 is that it's causing dust to collect on my other amps.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2018 6:20 am 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
Pongo wrote:
But for now, my only complaint with the TC-100 is that it's causing dust to collect on my other amps.


Yeah, I have that probelm. I think the TC-100 should come with a coupon for maid service. :lol:

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:41 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 4:57 pm
Posts: 4491
Location: South of Heaven
Pongo wrote:
but here, things really thin out as the gain is reduced.


I think this is more a function of the speakers than the amp.

Through Vintage 30s, reducing gain stiffens the amp until it starts to feel a little dead. I think the V30s are a little too clean/tight for lower gain settings and (IMO) excel with the gain turned up (or the gain turned down and the volume cranked, but either way the amp is providing the majority of the breakup). This "issue" isn't exclusive to the TC... I've had it with every Mesa I've owned through Mesa V30s. I think they're outstanding for high gain, but I also think it's why they never quite nail the low/mid gain sounds some people are looking for.

Put through Greenbacks (G12M-25s) and I can keep rolling the gain back while keeping a full sound. The Greenbacks are looser and add some of their own character/breakup to the mix, so they don't loose all their texture as the amp's distortion in reduced. If you're looking for more authentic low/mid gain tones, these speakers will get you there.

Long story short...

Classic crunch = Greenback

Modern chug = Vintage 30


IMO/YMMV

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|| McCarty | Les Paul | Custom 24 ||
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:28 pm 
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Mark I

Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:53 pm
Posts: 40
screamingdaisy wrote:
I think this is more a function of the speakers than the amp.
Interesting! Would not have guessed that... will run through a Type A tonight and see if it makes any difference!

Quote:
Through Vintage 30s, reducing gain stiffens the amp until it starts to feel a little dead. I think the V30s are a little too clean/tight for lower gain settings and (IMO) excel with the gain turned up (or the gain turned down and the volume cranked, but either way the amp is providing the majority of the breakup). This "issue" isn't exclusive to the TC... I've had it with every Mesa I've owned through Mesa V30s. I think they're outstanding for high gain, but I also think it's why they never quite nail the low/mid gain sounds some people are looking for.
Hahah... yeah, I've got strong feelings on Vintage 30s, myself. They're one of the easiest ways to be heard in your band, but to my ears, words and phrases like "dry," "harsh," or "box of angry hornets" come to mind. Sure, it's possible to get a good sound out of them, and tons of players have (especially metal specialists), but they're just too much work for me.

I'm currently playing through two Boogie Compact 1x12” Thiele Cabinets w/ C90s until I get a suitable 2x12"/4x12" replacement. It's a warm, even, and full-sounding setup, but as you might expect, not a ton of personality ("jack of all trades, master of none").

Like you, I love the sound of Greenbacks (both the 25 and 30 versions), but have heard too many horror stories of blown speakers. That's an expensive "Oops!" At 100 watts coupled with boosting effects, I'd be nervous using them in anything less than a 4x12"... and as cool as that would sound, that's not something I wanna be carting around! The Neo Creambacks seem to have the better qualities of both m-65 and h-75 Creambacks, and would easily work in a 2x12" context, but have only heard them in YouTube videos up to this point.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:04 pm 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
I recently coupled a Cream 90W alnico with a Creamback H75 in my RA100 combo. Now that sounds amazing and much different than I expected. Better than two 90W cream alnicos or two Creambacks (which is what I had before installing the two 90W'ers). I will have to channel the TC-100 though that and see how I like it. Was considering swapping out the speakers in the Horizontal 212 to see how it sounds in a closed back format. Not sure I would do that off the bat if the one cabinet is all you got (unless you really hate the V30 speaker).

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Current amps: TC-100, TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:14 pm 
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Mark I

Joined: Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:53 pm
Posts: 40
Quote:
I will have to channel the TC-100 though that and see how I like it.
YES!

No joke, I was minutes away from ordering a horizontal rectifier cab w/ Creamback 7H5 and Alnico Cream the other day. Things that stopped me were: 1) Upcharge (!) 2) I couldn't decide between full or compact version of the cab, and 3) lack of real-world experience hearing Alnico cream in a closed-back/higher gain setting.

If you can/will post any sound samples of that with your TC-100, that'd be super helpful. I know it's not closed back, but I'd love to hear it!

Alnico Cream is just one badass speaker, but IMO you are smart to pair it with something that has more bite. I love smooth, but there is such a thing as too much smooth...


EDIT for screamingdaisy:

Have been running through an A Type for the last hour... can't say if the thinning effect is actually less pronounced, or if the speaker is simply a little fatter and greasier no matter where you have the dial. I'd like to say I can hear noticeable difference, but nothing huge, no. On a related note, this is really making me wonder how A-types and V-types would sound together in a big box. V's are nice sounding and lack the bzzzzz of V30s that drives me crazy, but by themselves don't have a ton of personality...


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:52 pm 
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Triple Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Posts: 3059
Location: North Carolina
Hard to say If I will be recording anything soon. I actually found the Creme Alnico had more bite than the Creamback. Also the bottom end is more abundant. For some reason I think the pair of creme anlicos were cancelling each other out. They were wired correctly. Also the volume seemed to be lower and it did not matter if the pair of speakers were the original V30's, a pair of Creambacks or the anlico's. Odd that the cream and creamback just sound huge together. I can say this, the RA100 combo never sounded better. Still has a vintage tone but not as dramatic as it was when the two speakers were of the same type. If I can gather my gear and get a recoding thing going I will do it. Still want to push the JP-2C onto the RA100 combo with the mixed pair of speakers.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 4:26 pm 
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Donating Member
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Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 4:57 pm
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Location: South of Heaven
Pongo wrote:
EDIT for screamingdaisy:

Have been running through an A Type for the last hour... can't say if the thinning effect is actually less pronounced, or if the speaker is simply a little fatter and greasier no matter where you have the dial. I'd like to say I can hear noticeable difference, but nothing huge, no. On a related note, this is really making me wonder how A-types and V-types would sound together in a big box. V's are nice sounding and lack the bzzzzz of V30s that drives me crazy, but by themselves don't have a ton of personality...


Isn't an A Type speaker supposed to be American sounding (ie, scooped and Fender-ish)? That's pretty much the opposite of a G12M-25.

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Ignore the hype and trust your ears. Play more, buy less = better tone.

|| McCarty | Les Paul | Custom 24 ||
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