RA100 Combo with Creamback G12H-75

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bandit2013
Triple Recto
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Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Location: North Carolina

Re: RA100 Combo with Creamback G12H-75

Post by bandit2013 » Tue May 23, 2017 6:24 am

The recording would have sounded a bit better if the guitar was in tune. I was messing with it the night before during practice to match my friend so I think the low E was flat and the A and D may be on the sharp side. We were playing the blues and it sounded great with the guitar on the sour side the night before.

danyeo1
Mark IV
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Re: RA100 Combo with Creamback G12H-75

Post by danyeo1 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 5:30 pm

3 year bump. I picked up a Royal combo for a great price. My thoughts are the V30's gotta go. What I've been doing is not using the internal speakers in the royal cab but dragging the combo close to an Electra Dyne combo and using the Dyne as the cabinet for the Royal. The Dyne is a 1x12 and I loaded a Celestion Redback in there and it sounds a LOT better through the Dyne combo cabinet than it does though it's own cab with the pair of V30's. I think the Redback smooths out any annoying high end and adds a bit of bottom.

This guy posts a good comparison of the Redback vs creamback H75's. H75's sound good to me as well. I think both are better sounding than V30's.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tU1YkBsy-w
MarkIIC+,III, IV and V, ED clips here.

http://soundcloud.com/danieldowning

bandit2013
Triple Recto
Posts: 3152
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Location: North Carolina

Re: RA100 Combo with Creamback G12H-75

Post by bandit2013 » Sun Jul 12, 2020 10:43 am

I need to ask what power tubes are you using in the RA100 combo? This I found to be the key with the Royal head or combo as I have both. I have tried many different power tubes in this amp ranging from the stock tube STR447 (vary harsh sounding), Mullard Reissue EL34 (agressive) Tung Sol EL34B (b=bland in this amp) and a few others not worthy of noting. However, most impressive tube I have ever used and for the past 6 years in the head were the SED =C= EL34. Those put a smile on my face. I was disappointed to hear of the SED closing down production on consumer grate audio tubes. You can still find them like at places such as TheTubeStore. However there is a much better resource for these at reasonable price (still expensive but not a raping cost) is Mesa. STR442 SED =C= EL34 are available from their on-line store. Mesa branded and also has the SED =C= branding as well. I have bought a few of these and have a quad in my Combo.

Now for tuning the preamp section. You can basically leave it all stock tubes or opt to tighten up the Red channel and improve the blue with two preamp tubes of merit. They are of the NOS category but worth the expense as they fall in the low price point compared to the highly sought after tubes of that era. V1: NOS RFT/Siemens 12AX7/ECC83 and for V2: pre war Ei CV492 (often sold as a counterfeit Mullard long plate) Still that Ei tube sounds great. Why V2, it is the second gain stage for the blue and the tone stack for both red and blue. The RFT is similar to the JJ ECC83s in some respects but when the gain goes up and that added gain stage on the red channel the character of the beast is revealed. Bass remains tight and tone is well balanced. I am almost getting a Recto tone without the extended sub harmonics of a cold clipper circuit you get with the Recto. With the =C= EL34 and the two NOS preamp tubes this amp will give you that vintage vibe as well as some modern tone that cannot be found with other amps, including the TC series. After doing all of this experimentation, I had gone back to the original V30 speakers in my RA combo. I also use the combo with a Recto horizontal 212 cab to make a 412 combination but 4 ohm total load. I almost like that more than the RA100 half stack. Now with the multi-soak in use you actually can hear the tube saturation even on the clean channel. I never noticed it with the stock STR447 tubes. As for the Redbacks, I only have the one 8 ohm to try in the Mark V 90W combo I was having brittle ice pick tones on the lead channel that I could not tolerate. Redback did cut most of the upper frequency out of the mix as will the Celestion Cream 90W Alnico speaker. I personally did not admire the characteristic sound of the larger voice coil. Mind you that speaker will take abuse quite well as I tried to kill it with the JP-2C since it peaks at 140Wrms. That did help to break it in some, still it lacked the upper frequency range and took away character I would find appealing. It was as much as a blanket as the Creme 90W but did sound much better on the clean channel of the Mark V. Did not like it with the Royal. Sure I will hit a new speaker with everything I got to see if it has potential. I can see the point with the V30 in an open back cab as there may be some fizzy character at reduced volume. I could tell that the speakers that were in the combo were replaced due to the crappy soldering on the terminals. Looked like some cheap solder from a hardware store and had grainy appearance and too much which is an indication of poor soldering skills. I had cleaned off the cheese and soldered the terminals properly with a 60-40 tin lead solder and that made a huge difference since the solder joint was done properly. If you are after a more bluesy characteristic, the Creamback G12H75 were a good choice. I did like that in the Royal Combo but the tradeoff a lower volume. A blend of the Creamback and Cream 90W alnico (both 16 ohms) brought back some of the lost volume with a hint of alnico chime I could not get with the pair of Cream 90W speakers. It was not after restoring the amp with the V30 speakers is when I question why I took them out in the first place. I would personally start with the preamp and power tubes first before removing speakers. If you like the Redback tone it is up to you. I did not look at the link you provided yet but will after I submit the post. Keep in mind there are tonal differences between 8 ohm and 16 ohm speakers of the same type. I have also heard some great sounds of blending the CB H75 and CB M65.

bandit2013
Triple Recto
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Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
Location: North Carolina

Re: RA100 Combo with Creamback G12H-75

Post by bandit2013 » Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:08 am

danyeo1 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 5:30 pm
3 year bump. I picked up a Royal combo for a great price. My thoughts are the V30's gotta go. What I've been doing is not using the internal speakers in the royal cab but dragging the combo close to an Electra Dyne combo and using the Dyne as the cabinet for the Royal. The Dyne is a 1x12 and I loaded a Celestion Redback in there and it sounds a LOT better through the Dyne combo cabinet than it does though it's own cab with the pair of V30's. I think the Redback smooths out any annoying high end and adds a bit of bottom.

This guy posts a good comparison of the Redback vs creamback H75's. H75's sound good to me as well. I think both are better sounding than V30's.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tU1YkBsy-w
I watched the video but only heard H75 at the beginning. Was not sure what the other clips or cuts in the video. Some text insertion editing would be useful.
The Royal is true to its claims as a British voice amp. I recently got a Marshall Silver Jubilee 2555X head and compared it to both of my Royals as well as the Triple crown. The grind characteristics of the Silver Jubilee is dead on with the Royal and Triple. Red channels on the Mesa are identical to the lead channel, blue is the same as the clean with extended clipping and the cleans are damn close as well. Overall tone spectrum of the Mesa amp is more pleasing and full bodied where as the Marshall is a bit more focused, not bad but different. The Friedman is a Marshall clone of sorts but different as well so I would expect the overall character to be in the ball park. Not sure on the tube bias or plate voltage of that amp. The Marshall has Tung Sol EL34B but biased at 34ma per tube with a plate voltage of 475V ( ouch). Royal Atlantic plate voltage is 400V measured at center tap of the OT. I would assume the plate voltage on the tube would be at least 32v different (depends on tube impedance). Also what power tubes are in the Friedman? What may sound good for that amp may not be the same for the others. Creamback G12H75 was a nice sound for the combo, that I can say. It mellowed it out well but at that time I was using Mullard reissue tubes since the resource of =C= were questionable, that is until MESA added them to their offering on their website. I am tempted to get another pair of the NOS Siemens STR450 since they did have a creamy sound but yet similar to the Mesa STR447(EHX EL34) without the harsh and brash tone. For me, the SED =C= EL34 (Mesa STR442) are gold. If you amp is running on the harsh side of the tone farm, it may not make much of a difference what speakers you use. Just remember the RA can be tuned with preamp tubes and power tubes and the speaker will be the final filter. Tubes and speakers, guitars and such all become subjective topics. Perhaps what path I follow may be different than yours. For me the Royal is the best sounding Mesa amp yet for what I use it for. I generally do not use the footswitch and leave the amp on the red channel. I use my guitar volume control to adjust the level of gain characteristic. Red channel set such that the chicken head points to the top of the blue channel master, midrange to the top of the bass control, treble points top of the gain control and the gain is at noon. I may adjust the master volume control if I am using the multi-soak at is -4db setting and may opt for 50W or 100W. For the past few years, my Royal Atlantics get the most attention as that is my grail tone. Still using the same SED =C= EL34 I installed a few years ago, not sure when that was, 2014 for the head. I did not have the Mesa branded ones until about 2 years ago.

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