RA100 Combo with Creamback G12H-75

[bandit2013]

I was debating if I should go with the G12H-65 (based on the greenback speaker) since it had a brighter or pushed mids at the upper end. However, based on a recommendation from someone here (CORY) I chose the G12H-75 Creamback speakers. Thanks a lot Cory, I am very happy I came across your thread. I ordered the speakers that arrived today. Before I made any changes I decided to get some recordings of before an after. As a bench mark I rolled out the big brother to the combo for a side by side comparison. Both amps sound identical thought the 412 cabinet (head has Mesa EL34, Combo has Tung Sol EL34B due to low mechanical noise). What I really wanted was the same tonal character I get from the oversized Mesa cab. The stock V30 in the combo seem to be too rich in the midrange frequencies that drown out the top end. Typically I have to dial down the treble, but found I had to add more treble with the combo. The Celestion G12H-75 Creamback speakers deliver the Mesa 412 character perfectly. The Creamback speaker has a good balance of mids to treble and a bit more bass. I believe the Creamback offers a better tonal range for the RA100 Combo. Again, THANK YOU CORY for the recommendation.


For starters, I match the settings on the combo that I normally use with the RA Head and made a few recordings. I used the Vintage Lo (blue) for the recording and a superstrat with single coil sized humbuckers. As for the mic's, I used a Shure Sm57 at the center of one of the speakers, an EV RE320 at the midpoint between edge and dust cap of the other speaker, and at 6 ft distance a RODE NT1-A and blended it all together during the mixdown. I do not think the recordings turned out as I had hope they would. Also had the reverb on which was not supposed to be active (so I left it on for the rest). Yes I do need to practice but figured to play something that sounds familiar even though I really do not know the songs all that well.

Benchmark: RA100 combo amp channeled though Mesa OS Recto Cab
https://soundcloud.com/user-353100000/ra412wav

Stock RA100 Combo
https://soundcloud.com/user-353100000/racombov30wav

Modified RA100 Combo with pair Creamback G12H-75
https://soundcloud.com/user-353100000/racreambackswav

[bandit2013]

CA-ZANG is what you get when you mix a Creamback with the V30. I had to try it and really dig this in the Combo. I will hold removed speakers for future use. Having another 212 with the same combination would put the V30 loaded 412 to shame. I first started off with the superstrat (all humbuckers in smaller single coil package). The two Creambacks sounded really good up to a point. Seemed to be missing something that was removed by taking out the V30's. I did not pick up my humbucker equipped guitars at this point as my Superstrat is one of my main axes.

Elvis suggested mixing the two, Creamback and V30. Not the cats meow but the CA-ZAAANG, holy Royal makeover, Elvis, thanks for the suggestion.
Now all of my guitars sound amazing though the RA100 with the mix in paper and magnets. Amazingly, the Wampler Plexi Drive sounds exactly like this though the clean channel. I will have to try it with my other amps and see how that turns out. I was planning on holding off on getting the Plexi drive but what the heck why not. Just a simple change in one speaker gave me the thick toast I wanted in the first place with just the right amount of jam or jelly make it gooey.

I have no plans on changing my 412 by any means. However, the RA100 combo sounds killer

[elvis]

So glad that worked for you! Now I'm definitely converting my RA2x12. I was turned on to that combination by thumbpick. It seemed crazy at the time, but it's potent.

[bandit2013]

Thumbpick has a great rig, perfect sound, the band Kindler is awesome. Those guys have it together quite well. I really do enjoy his posts of the videos.

I was playing so long and loud with the combo I gave myself a headache, but every minute was worth it. I wish I could bond with the Mark V but yet it lacks that simple complexity of the gain structure I get from either the RA100 or Roadster. Even the Carvin V3MC is a pleasure to play though. I was successful in mounting the Jensen Black Bird into that small amp and it was completely transformed into a sweet blues machine (I have it tubed for that character). It was also the reason to let the Mark IV go for funding of the drum kit I have since the V3MC sounds very close to the Mark IV in some respects especially when driving a 412 cab (comparing the combo, not quite the same when the IV is pushing air though a 412 as it becomes a beast at that point, also the only time RHY2 was of any use.) I should have kept the head shell from the Mark V and converted to the Mark IV from a combo to head, chassis fit, but you could not do the opposite and use the Mark IV shell for the Mark V due to differences in the front of the chassis. Probably the best Mark Series amp I ever owned may have been the Mark III blue stripe but I found it irritating for a 3 mode amp to use the same controls, made it difficult to set different settings. For a simul-class amp, it had the mojo but was rather dark in its tone. I will probably keep the Mark V and just use it for its intended purpose which is a direction I am moving away from. I am sure I can fit it into something if and when I get around to another project. Too bad I am not as good as I used to be, but its all fun.

I did try the Wampler Plexi-drive deluxe, that would be perfect if I did not have such good amps that can do the same job without the need for a OD pedal. I may give it to a friend as a Christmas Present as he only has a 65 Fender Twin and really wants that Malcolm Young tone. He just goes nuts over it. However, I have figured it out using the Carvin amp and I sort of like it. It just did not impress me through any of the Mesa's since they can do exactly the same thing (Except the Mark V, just can not dial it in even with the Plexi-drive though it.) After living the experience of the RA100 Combo and the mixed pair, I want to get another 2x12 cab so I can make use of the other speaker. A half stack but open/ported arrangement would be really nice.

[bandit2013]

I really love the combination of the G12H-75 with the V30 in the RA100 Combo as this is the perfect blend to my ears. I had to make a temporary extension cable so I could experiment with the other amps. The Mark V actually became alive and sounded extremely dynamic and not sterile. The Mark V does sound better though the Recto 412 but still on the bright side of the spectrum. Though the RA100 combo cabinet it was definitely a considerable improvement so much that I would convert the V back to a head and get a vertical 2x12 and stuff that with a G12H-75 and a V30. I am so tempted to buy the compact 2x12 and swap just one speaker. This is what I may end up doing anyway since that would match the RA100 Combo size and color scheme.

I did try it with the Roadster just for kicks, a little different. I actually prefer my old Recto cab I refurbished as the 15 year old V30 had a darker sound and were not as bright as the new Recto cab. I am so tempted to break the seal of the new cab and install two of the G12H-75's. I am sort of reluctant to do so since the speakers are barely broken in yet, perhaps some other time.

A note on the RA100 Combo, I did not have to change any preamp tubes as the ones that were in were in great shape. However, since I did not have an extra set of the Mesa EL34's (currently in the RA100 Head) I put in the Tung Sol EL34B. My first impression of these tubes in the Head gave the amp more bite and volume when compared to the small bottle Mesa tubes. With the Combo, the Tung Sol EL34B are perfect and do really sound close to the SED (=c=) EL34 in comparison - installed the =c= first but the rattle was driving me nuts. I just did not notice it as much with the new recto cab combined with the RA100 Head. Just thinking about the V30 mix with the G12H-75 is making me drool. Nice and creamy tone, not too choppy or mid level muddy, no flubby sounds, no ice pick either. (I can actually push the treble control up vs all the way down).

For some reason, I wish I never bought the G12H-75 creambacks as this has fueled the need to get more as they compliment the V30 quite well. Definitely worth it. Since I bought 2, now I need another cab to go with it I am extremely pleased with this speaker.

[J.J]

I've been running a G12M-65 Creamback with a V30 in my 2x12 for nearly two years and love it. It seems that the Greenback is almost forgotten in modern times. I've always loved the crunchy 70's and 80's rock tones. Was never able to nail it until I got a greenback.

I have JCM800 that I bought as a teenager, but it came with a JCM900 cab with G12T-75s. That made me think for many years that I had the wrong guitar or OD pedals the G12T would have to be my least favourite Celestion speaker.

[bandit2013]

I had a Marshall back in the late 80's. It did not impress me all that much but was affordable. I have no clue what speakers were in the cabinet, at this point in time I no longer want to think about it. Mesa Mark III satisfied my needs.

It is amazing what the right speakers will do. I finally settled on the Jensen Blackbird in the Mark V. Once it is fully broken in, the Mark V could easily make choosing what amp to play first quite difficult. That really transformed the amp such that it is like starting at day one to learn the character of the amp and how to dial it in. I thought the RA100 had some great classic character to the sound, the G12H-75 surely makes that possible, however the Jensen Jet Blackbird in an amp typically known for heavy metal is now competing with the RA100 for the vintage vibe. I knew alnico speakers had some certain character to them but did not expect this. I was also looking at the Celestion Alnico Crème which is a 90W speaker. Some have mentioned in reviews that the mids are a bit too much. I guess I will never know until I try one. So far everything amp related has panned out for the better. Now all I need to do is focus on learning how to play...

[elvis]

Finally got around to swapping one of the V30 in my RA 2x12 cab for a Creamback 75 like in my recto 2x12. Part laziness, part not wanting to open up a brand new cab...

Anyway, it sounds fantastic with my RA100. Really brings out the mid harmonics.

The tough part with the combination of speakers is mic'ing the cabinet. Most venues throw one mic there. I always have trouble deciding which speaker to mic. I'd like to get both. Lately I have been using a CabClone to give a direct out, but it's not perfect either. Not bad, though.

Any opinions?

[bandit2013]

if the cab is ported on the back, mic the port. Not sure how that will sound but may work, also change the phase of the mic at the mixer if at all possible. You may also try a mic with different pattern.

[elvis]

Interesting ideas!

[bandit2013]

Why not just use a stereo mic on the two speakers. I do that all the time even though I only have one speaker in the Mark V, or if there are more than one speaker in the cab I will use a Shure SM57 on one and EV RE320 on the other. I would like to get a Sennheiser E906 one of these days for amp mic. Recently I added a RODE NT1-A for recording acoustic guitar but have used it in the studio for capture of sound from the amp but at a distance along with the other two mics I mentioned. So far, all three seem to blend well during mix-down. For live application, and if you only have one channel available, try the mic at the port of the RA2x12.

Too bad they discontinued them. I would like to get one but hard to find. I will opt for the Compact Recto 2x12 which is sealed and made for the Roadster combo. I am going to buy new so I can swap the new V30 and put that in the combo and add the other G12H-75CB in the cab. My 412 cab is too new to want to open it up and change speakers. Sounds great as it is so I will not alter it yet. One thing I can say about the new 412 cab, it is very hard to get the speakers to do the recto v30 flub. The 15 year old cab is all it did when you opened up the volume (but that was with a Mark IVb which was practically maxed out at a master volume setting of 3 which would translate in an RA100 as no volume.)

I recently saw Celestion has a 90W Alnico version. I am fine with what I got at the moment.

[elvis]

I don't mic at home, just on the gigs. And they only ever give me one channel.

Keep your eyes open. It took me a few months to happen on to a RA2x12. But it did come up.

[bandit2013]

I will keep looking.

In the meantime, I will take out the V30 that came with the RA100 Combo, and put back the G12H-75. First I want to be able to break them in, and have a chance to get used to the different speakers. From a first person perspective (not through recording) the pair of creambacks is much closer to the V3 loaded 412 than the mix. Eventually I will get an extension cab and use one of the V30's from that to mix with the G12H-75CB.

Thanks for the suggestion.

[bandit2013]

I played for a while with both G12H-75 creambacks installed. I think I like this better than the mix. Also depends on what guitar I am using. I have more detail with a higher gain setting than I would get with the V30 (as a pair or a mix). It is also much closer to the RA100 head and Mesa 412 but not as bright as the 412. I am going to have fun breakin in these speakers. I am actually using the treble at a higher setting rather than an attenuator. The G12H-75 almost have a similar character as the Jensen Black Bird I stuffed into the Mark V. There is some resonating overtones that would make you think the G12H-75 was an Alnico speaker vs ceramic.

[screamingdaisy]

I generally haven't been a fan of mixing speakers, particularly if they're in the same cab. There's a certain immediacy and clarity when all the speakers match that I prefer.