Mark V recording

What are some of the mics and or other things people have used to get good recordings. I'm just starting to record again. It has been quite a few years. Drive sounds for me always seemed the most difficult. The way the amp sounds to my ears isn't what comes out when recorded. The frequencies tend to be more on the high end instead of the midrange that I hear. Also the drive sounds way more driven when recorded. Is a cab clone the best solution? I really don't want to have to EQ the recording to a twisted mess. I have done lots of recording but I never had really driven guitar. Well driven with tubes...I used to be on the "Dark Side".... digital. Digital is easy cause it's basically line level and all effects. Just dial in the sound through the processors send through the board and that is what it sounds like recorded. Press record, garbage in garbage out. LOL

All information will be greatly appreciated.

I don't know anything about recording, though I've done a fair bit of it. I always trust the engineer to get the right sound.
Literally dump my amp in the booth and tell him "EQ that for us will ya mate".

Then go and play in the control room, listening to the amp through the studios monitors. It's never how it sounds in the booth. I believe because of proximity and because of the way the human ear works in relation to proximity.
The ear is geared up to mid frequencies. Why so many of us have a love/hate affair with them. If you have your amp on the floor and studio monitors at ear height, things will sound different. Lift your amp to ear height and it will sound different.

Personally I just accept the fact that the sounds I need for recording are very different to how I hear them, what I prefer to hear coming from an amp. And learned to put up with that when recording. I want to try that re-amping thing, I've heard about. Next time I record. Split the guitar signal, one to the amp, one directly to the board. That way I may be able to play in the booth with the sound I like. Then re-amp the recorded sound to use what works. Though I can see that probably has it's pitfalls

I record direct and then apply speaker sims (impulse responses) in my daw. For the direct signal, I use the line out from either a thd hotplate or a rivera rockcrusher.

You will never get exactly what you hear from the amp to come out in the recording. For driven sounds, I have found that there is always a bit of buzz that can be easily improved by cutting a couple dB somewhere in the 4k-5k Hz range.

If you are recording at home, you may find that silent recording is a good option. Running the amp very compressed in the preamp and low volume at the output will kill your dynamics and sound too smooth and muddy. Turning up and reducing input gain makes a huge difference. Running direct with a CabClone would let you do that without getting evicted. In my experience you will likely need to add some low-end via EQ when direct recording.

I use a Two-Notes Torpedo Live for recording, that thing is just pure magic !

If you have the luxury of a good engineer and studio, there's nothing like it.

At my home studio, I have never been able to nail those sounds properly. So now, I use a dummy load (http://www.suhr.com/amplifiers-for-electric-guitars/Reactive-Load/), take a DI out to my DAW and use speaker/mic IRs from Ownhammer. The Justin York collection (http://www.ownhammer.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=358)which has Mesa Cabs is top notch and sounds much better than miking my cab.

Well I'm experimenting with a cab clone. So far nothing to my taste has come from it. I'm trying to get a good tone without EQing the pee out of it on the Digital recorder. Of course my problem is great sound from the amp and trying to get that tone recorded. In the past I was recording songs so I just made the guitar tone fit what the song needed. I always had good luck with just using a mic on the cabinets. It looks like that is what I will be trying next.

crane said:

I use a Two-Notes Torpedo Live for recording, that thing is just pure magic !

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I am about to get one of these units. Most cab clone demos that I've heard are disappointing and almost every Torpedo Live one I hear is great!

Here is a recording I got from the cabclone.

Recorded on an Akai DPS 12 with no effects or EQ on anything. I squashed the pee out of the signal with a XOTIC SP Compressor. The bass was me and my truly have not a clue bass playing but it is a Warwick Corvette bass direct into the recorder. I used a Roland TR-626 for drums using a factory pattern. Again no enhancements or post production. Guitar gear used: Mark V, Cab Clone, 2x12 compact Rectifier cabinet (to provide a load for the Cab Clone), XOTIC SP Compressor, Strymon Blue Sky Reverb, Strymon Ola Chorus, 2 Nady Audio HE-1 Hum Eliminators and a Sure wireless (it's quiet..LOL)

https://soundcloud.com/user-201672201/guitar-chorus-reverb2

Here's a blog post about how to mic a speaker cabinet for recording: Idiot-Proof Electric Guitar & Bass Mic Technique https://michaeljamesproducer.wordpr...iot-proof-electric-guitar-bass-mic-technique/ Hopefully you'll find it helpful.

Re: EQ, try to capture the tone at the source, and use as little EQ as possible in the mix. Listen to the speaker with your ears right in front of the cone so that you can hear the same thing that the microphone will hear, then adjust the amp settings accordingly.

Re: CabClone, I occasionally use it for silent recording, and get good results. Be aware, however, that you will need to adjust your amp settings to account for the fact that it's not capturing the sound of the room, nor is it reacting with a speaker. The recording may sound thin when you solo the track, but should sound good in the context of the mix--especially if you add a touch of ambience to make it sound like the amp was recorded in a room instead of direct.

Let us know if this helps your recordings!

I too have been attempting to capture the natural sound. I have two dynamic mic's I use for guitar and have tried a third mic that has a different dynamic range. SM57 works well but I often couple that with a RE320. Recently I got a condenser mic and have been quite pleased with it especially for acoustic guitar recording. However, the condenser mic tends to be more sensitive so it cannot be placed against the cab, more of a distance thing. Also since they clip at higher SPL when compared to the dynamic type it does get complicated. I usually listen to the track and adjust the EQ to match what I hear but I do this though the stereo or now called home theater to adjust the track EQ (I usually avoid the use of headphones when doing the mix down as I tend to drop the bass too much.) Position of the mic is also important as the selection of the mic. I am still learning this process and have not fully grasped the art or engineering at this point in time.

In my limited experience - I have learned that even when your going for a high gain sound- you gotta dial the gain back a good bit on your amp for recording- because by the time you double track the guitars- it gets massive. Too much gain and too much on the bass things get flabby real quick and you loose articulation and note definition in passages.

To second what some folks have said - I almost exclusively use the Two Notes Torpedo this thing absolutely blows me away overtime I track guitars.

BeltFedRiffs said:

In my limited experience - I have learned that even when your going for a high gain sound- you gotta dial the gain back a good bit on your amp for recording- because by the time you double track the guitars- it gets massive. Too much gain and too much on the bass things get flabby real quick and you loose articulation and note definition in passages.

To second what some folks have said - I almost exclusively use the Two Notes Torpedo this thing absolutely blows me away overtime I track guitars.

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I'm still waiting for my Torpedo Live... it was supposed to be in stock like 3 weeks ago, then a few days ago, and now I don't know when. grr

Which interface do you use with the torpedo?

I use it @home with a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2, or when recording with the band with a M-Audio Profire 2626.
You can also record direct via its USB interface, but only in 48/96 KHz.
One good option is to record (either way) WITHOUT the cab/mic simulation and then use the Wall of Sound plugin to test several cab/mic/mic placement.

crane said:

I use it @home with a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2, or when recording with the band with a M-Audio Profire 2626.
You can also record direct via its USB interface, but only in 48/96 KHz.
One good option is to record (either way) WITHOUT the cab/mic simulation and then use the Wall of Sound plugin to test several cab/mic/mic placement.

Click to expand...

Oh ok. I have an Avid mbox (which I'm not crazy about since the pro tools light version that came with it is meh and I like Reaper), but I am thinking about a 2i4 or 6i6 (I want the option of spdif and I can't remember which one has it). I also thought about Apogee but they don't support Windows (I have a Macbook but I would prefer to have both options).

If not the Live, they have the Torpedo Reload in stock but that's not standalone.. the Torpedo Studio is in stock but $$$.

I can't attest to cabclone in a recording environment, I think that it has a definite home live though. Personally for all the recording I've done of my guitar amps, I have been using a Heil PR35 for a very long while. This mic has been through high gain wars on stage and it handles loud cabinets extremely well thus allowing you to turn up and get that driven sound that you want. If a under $300.00 mic is what you seek, then I'd recommend the PR35.

Hope this helps,
Cheers!

It took me a while to capture the sound of my RA100 Combo such that it sounded close to what I hear in the room but after all that I lost interest in recording a new song I have been working on. Looked into the Cab Clone and two notes torpedo live. I have yet to look at the rock crusher. So far the two notes torpedo live with the included software seems to be the best approach for capturing the amp of my choice. Definitely will have to rebuild my gear fund to get one. For now I will settle with the mics or use the GT-100 but that seems to be too artificial for what I am trying to develop. I would prefer to capture the amp and the tonal character of the speakers. What seemed to work was a SM57 at mid point from center to edge with a RE320 off axis which sounded really good. That works for the RA100 combo. If I add a condenser mic at a distance I can get some interesting results. I would prefer something simple, plug and play but sounds good and does not require doctoring after it has been recorded. Perhaps the cost of the Torpedo live is worth it. From what I can recall, it works with bass too.

I just started to test recording around mark v with new audient id14 audio interface.
Surprisingly I found out mark v slave output (line signal level) direct to audio interface, then using free lepou plugins, LeCab with few Impulse Response (IR) profiles actually produced very very promising sound compared to my actual SM57 mic recording!

I used to GAS for cabclone since it came out, but now i'm very satisfied with the sound i can get from SM57 mic and plugins.

note: always connect to actual cab while recording via slave output!

I decided to give the Rivera Rockcrusher Recording attenuator a try. It does sound very close to mic'ing with an SM57. What I do like about it is the 11 band EQ so I can tailor the response to get very close to the actual cabinet sound. I also added a few effects to my collection. Strymon DIG, Ola, Bigsky and the OB.1 compressor. Since I do not use a DAW for recording or editing I do not have the option for plug-in cab simulators as I am using a 32 track Tascam DP-32SD recorder for everything. I went this route as with computers there is always a hitch, crashes, and what not as I had experienced this with video editing too many times. I have placed a link to a practice run of a project. Not bad as far as content but it is full of errors. Drums were supplied by a Rolland TD-15kv (I would have an acoustic set but do not have the room). I am a beginning drummer (still learning to play them and having fun doing so). I also started playing the Bass about the same time. The main rhythm portion (almost could make up for a lead) was recorded with the Mark V, CH4 extreme mode. I ran two effects in stereo (single to stereo hookup) in the DP-32SD effects loop: Strymon Bigsky reverb in parallel to the Strymon DIG. I also recorded the raw track to blend in the mix. The Mark V effects loop I had a Boss Tera Echo. For the fill in dirt I used CH3 in Mark 1 mode. During mixdown I chose to add a narrow notch filter on the channel to accentuate the tone a bit. Bass and drums were sent direct to the Tascam recorder. This is the first time I decided to use the Mark V for recording. I normally use the Roadster or RA100. Also the first or second attempt recording without microphones. Note: with the attenuator in use, best to allow for the speaker to provide enough sound for feedback purpose as you will not get that with the attenuator only, also this may effect the recorded sound as the speaker load will be different than the full load of the attenuator in the signal. I am actually please with using the Rockcrusher recording attenuator. I figured if it was not to my liking I could always get the Two Notes Torpedo C.A.B and use that as a cab simulator driven from the Rockcrusher as it does have line level capability. Another note: this piece is 8 minutes long. Listen as far as you can endure. It is not perfect as I am not a seasoned musician by any means. This is a blend of Pink Floyd mixed with a little Deep Purple style.

https://soundcloud.com/user-353100000/tempted01wav

OldTelecasterMan said:

Here is a recording I got from the cabclone.

Recorded on an Akai DPS 12 with no effects or EQ on anything. I squashed the pee out of the signal with a XOTIC SP Compressor. The bass was me and my truly have not a clue bass playing but it is a Warwick Corvette bass direct into the recorder. I used a Roland TR-626 for drums using a factory pattern. Again no enhancements or post production. Guitar gear used: Mark V, Cab Clone, 2x12 compact Rectifier cabinet (to provide a load for the Cab Clone), XOTIC SP Compressor, Strymon Blue Sky Reverb, Strymon Ola Chorus, 2 Nady Audio HE-1 Hum Eliminators and a Sure wireless (it's quiet..LOL)

https://soundcloud.com/user-201672201/guitar-chorus-reverb2

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That actually doesn't sound bad at all. I can get some nice clean tones with the Cabclone. but, the lead channel is more tricky. Here's my sample with the clean channel on the MkV 25...

https://youtu.be/Zxpmg5_IJUc