Crunch mode on MK V 25 vs channel 2 Crunch mode Mk V

How do these two compare?

I really like the clips I hear of the crunch mode on channel 1 of the 25 but I would also need a "funk"
clean on channel 1. Not possible to footswitch on the lil' V 25.

So can the Mark V channel 2 crunch get in the same realm as his lil sister's crunch mode?

Question already asked and answered by "Authorized Boogie" here:
http://www.grailtone.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=68559&start=15
:wink:

Unfortunately no. The mid/gain control on the V:25 allows the Crunch mode to be driven to Recto levels of gain and saturation. Maybe a pedal could drive the 90 watt V enough to get close but since I'm not a pedal guy I can't really speak intelligently enough about them to be sure.
If I were still gigging I'd probably buy another V:25 or a Recto 25 to run in stereo and so I could have the crunch channel available along with a clean. It's that good.

There's quite a bit of gain on tap in the Crunch mode on the Mark V. It can definitely get into the same realm. I haven't had a chance to play the Mark V 25 yet, but I'd go for the regular Mark V if you need to be able to footswitch between cleans/crunch. The edge and crunch modes of channel 2 take a boost pedal really well too for even more tonal flexibility.

Just spent some quality time with crunch mode.

Wow!

Seriously wow.

Now I am seriously thinking about putting my JCM 800 2204 for sale.

ryjan said:

Unfortunately no. The mid/gain control on the V:25 allows the Crunch mode to be driven to Recto levels of gain and saturation.

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Don't feel too bad for Mark V owners though. The extra thump and authority provided by the 45 watt and 90 watt settings kind of makes up for that, even at low volumes.

I like the idea of a builtin extra boost (not that I need one).
I'm just not sure I would want it as an extension of the mid pot, however. To engage the boost, you are also cranking the mids, and I seldom want to crank the mids that much. But I do crank the Treble a lot with a Mark V and regularly use it as a treble booster for my medium/high gain sounds, so if I had been given the choice, I might have placed the boost functionality to that pot instead of the Mid pot. Or as a separate control that doesn't require me to dial my channel EQ in any particular way.

LesPaul70 said:

ryjan said:

Unfortunately no. The mid/gain control on the V:25 allows the Crunch mode to be driven to Recto levels of gain and saturation.

Click to expand...

Don't feel too bad for Mark V owners though. The extra thump and authority provided by the 45 watt and 90 watt settings kind of makes up for that, even at low volumes.

Click to expand...

Moreover, it would be very easy to mod the Mark V in order to have the "boost" functionnality on the mid pot of channel 2.
I am pretty sure it is just a 100k log pot in place of the original 10k lin pot. I am strengthened in this thought by the description of the V:25 manual (page 19).
At 12 o'clock, the value of the 100k log pot is approximatively 10k, just like the maxed original pot. And above 12 o'clock, it raises more and more the tonestack from the ground, resulting in a boost. It is acting just like the "pull gain boost" switch of the Mark I, IIA and IIB, except it is adjustable and less drastic (it doesn't lift completely the tonestack from ground).

LesPaul70 said:

I like the idea of a builtin extra boost (not that I need one).
I'm just not sure I would want it as an extension of the mid pot, however. To engage the boost, you are also cranking the mids, and I seldom want to crank the mids that much. But I do crank the Treble a lot with a Mark V and regularly use it as a treble booster for my medium/high gain sounds, so if I had been given the choice, I might have placed the boost functionality to that pot instead of the Mid pot. Or as a separate control that doesn't require me to dial my channel EQ in any particular way.

Click to expand...

The problem of the boost function of this pot on the V:25 is more complex than that. It is not only a matter of loosing flexibility in the mid control dialing.
By lifting progressively the tonestack from ground, all of the 3 tone controls loose most of their frequency shapping power. But you may feel that the balance of frequencies resulting from this is not so bad.

^Interesting

So who is gonna be the first to mod there Mark V?

I would love to use Crunch mode on my Mark V but just wish it had a bit more gain. I hate using pedals for boost they sound like poo to me. I like the girth and the harmonics but it just needs a little more saturation.

barryswanson said:

So who is gonna be the first to mod there Mark V?

I would love to use Crunch mode on my Mark V but just wish it had a bit more gain. I hate using pedals for boost they sound like poo to me. I like the girth and the harmonics but it just needs a little more saturation.

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There is more perceived gain available in Channel 2 if you run the Treble & Presence higher than you might normally. If the tone becomes harsh, you can use the 5 band to push the highs down a bit.

IMO Channel 2 takes boost pedals extremely well. Which boosts have you tried?

A Klon and a Um, (clears throat) Boss Metal Zone

jc986 said:

There is more perceived gain available in Channel 2 if you run the Treble & Presence higher than you might normally.

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Exactly! If you look at the video of Petrucci trying the V:25, you can see the settings of the crunch channel (for example at 5'00 and 8'55).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjkfArHfV6Q
The treble is set high and the mid pot is set pretty low, before the boost becomes active.
Despite that, the tone is very higain to me. And with those settings, it's a tone that should be achieved with a Mark V without the mid pot mod I described above.

Moreover, when you look at Petrucci's demo of the Mark V:
with the crunch channel at 4'50 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kOIx7HbhxQ
I feel that his tone is very aggressive when palm muting and it doesn't lack gain and doesn't need a pedal boost in front of the amp.

As jc986 wrote (and Petrucci says the same thing in the previous video above, last link), cranking the treble gives you more gain.

Yeah but if you turn up the gain you loose the chunky lows. But I guess like anything there is some sort of trade off.

Couldn't this be overcomed by raising the 80 Hz slider of the GEQ ?

Yeah but mine is already maxed out

barryswanson said:

Yeah but if you turn up the gain you loose the chunky lows. But I guess like anything there is some sort of trade off.

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I wonder if it is a pickup (or possibly perceptions thing)

I say perception because sometimes what I perceive has high gain others will think is not enough gain.

And of course tone is in the ear of the beholder.

in Crunch mode I keep my mid on the 25 fairly low, probably 9 o'clock and just put the gain up pretty high. Not maxed but fairly close.
And I have my bass almost off, which ironically is what I would also do on the marshall amps whose tone I would be trying to emulate.

Gets me into old van halen territory easily.

So I really don't use the mid boost at all.

So "authorized boogie" says they are the same. I think he says....."crunch channel was pulled directly from the Mark V"

But....it seems they are not after reading through the replys.

Maybe he can chime in and explain...

Finnster said:

So "authorized boogie" says they are the same. I think he says....."crunch channel was pulled directly from the Mark V"

But....it seems they are not after reading through the replys.

Maybe he can chime in and explain...

Click to expand...

My guess is they are the same with the exception of the mid pot.

Cause if the mid pot is not different, then it would also behave the same on the 90 watter.

It is also my guess.

So "authorized boogie" says they are the same. I think he says....."crunch channel was pulled directly from the Mark V"
But....it seems they are not after reading through the replys....


the circuits are the same but you have to realize the mini mark is using EL-84 tube,whole different dynamic to the awesome sound!!
correct me if not the case..