Mark V good enough?

I know my title probably didn't make sense but here is where I was going with this....

I have a dual rec and a Mark V. I love the V. I am really looking for a Metallica type tone and I think I am pretty close. I always see people on the boards saying that the MArk iv gets an even closer "Metallica" tone. And I just hear that the lead channel is better on the iv in general. It makes me wonder if I should get a iv. Anyone who has experience with these amps.... Is it THAT much of a difference or is it subtle? I know tone is subjective but I often wonder if I am getting a true Mark tone out of my V.

I have also heard that the V's geq is less powerful but I called Mesa and they said it's exactly the same eq.

Am I overthinking this?

Am I overthinking this?

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Yup.

And fwiw, I can get closer to their studio tone on my Roadster than I ever could with my Mark IV.

over thinking... over analyzing separates the body from the mind (8)

I heard that the IV have a more vintage sound than the V... some people prefer it, some don't... fortunately I haven't had the oportunity to compare them side by side or I will be in the same position that you are now

Haha Nice. Got some Tool lyrics in there!

I own a Triple Rec, a Mark IV and a Mark V. Yes, the Mark IV will do Hetfield's tone better than the V - no contest - it's way more aggressive, saturated and ballsy than the V. While I love the V, Channel 3 falls just short of nailing that tone IMO. I owned the V for 3 years before picking a IV so I had plenty of time to get to know the V.

BUT with that said - you'll get way closer to Metallica's studio tone if you combine your Recto with your Mark in stereo, playing each through its own recto 4x12 cab. You get the tightness of the Mark with the wideness and low end of the Recto. It sounds HUGE!! I use a Flashback delay out front to split my signal and run a G Major 2 in the loop of the Mark and leave the Recto dry. The flashback delay only gets turned on for cleans since its out front.

If I could only keep 1 it would be the IV. I know someone above said they could get closer with a Rectifier but that's simply not the case for me. The IV, at least mine, is Hetfield in a box. My Triple, even with a TS9 is too loose and gritty/chainsawy when played by itself to nail that sound and feel.

OH boy....a Mark and rec in stereo!! I can't believe I haven't done this yet. Guess what I'm doing this weekend!

firmani99 said:

OH boy....a Mark and rec in stereo!! I can't believe I haven't done this yet. Guess what I'm doing this weekend!

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Make sure you turn the gain down a smudge on both amps when running in stereo - if there's too much gain it can start to sound/feel mushy. You won't notice the gain drop since it's going to sound so much more brutal.

Mark V plus a BBE 427 Pedal (LED based OD pedal) does a pretty good job for hitting that tone on Channel 2.

FWIW, here is a comparison I did of my Mark V to my blue stripe Mark III, arguably the most aggressive of the Mark series http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=66864.

As far as aggression is concerned, I'd say that the difference is there, but likely too subtle for an untrained ear to recognize. I'd imagine that the Mark IV sits somewhere in between these two.

It really depends of which James sound by album you like. Personally, I would not even consider the first two albums, as I really did not like the sound. But, from Master of Puppets up until the Black album, James was using a Mark II C+ (rewired to be just a preamp) in conjunction with either a Marshall or a Mesa Boogie Power Amp. For Black album and pretty much beyond, he used the Mark IV, also rewired as a preamp in conjunction with a Mesa Power Amp. He also uses during the Black Album a Triaxis system as well. For his clean sound, he opts for a Roland JC-120. Live, from what I can determine so far, he uses the Triaxis with the Mesa 2:90 Power amp and he mixes that sound with the Diezel Amp (sorry, I forget the model). On some tours, he also used a Tremo-Verb. I will dig up a little more information, I am off to meet a client now. At the end of the day, it really depends on your personal taste. Always remember, a lot of a persons sound also comes from their fingers, so even if you get the exact same gear, your picking style, angle, hand strength, etc all lends itself to your tone as well!!! The boys at Mesa are always quick to remind me of that, when I had asked about John Petrucci's amp choice and tone... LOL

Barrett "Rockguy66" Hamilton

The recto and any old Mark series will work. I have a rectoverb and MKIIC.

If you are going to be chasing the best possible tone out of the recto, boost it for tighter chug.

I have ran a recto with a DSL and MKIIC, it is indeed the great combination of two dissimilar but complimentary amps. It may be heresy to say on the Boogie Board, but borrow a Marshall tube head if you have to, and try it. The mid bark of the Marshall goes great with the scooped growl of the recto.

For a single amp to do Metallica, and I am a Metallica fan boy, it is the MKIIC. If you know you will chase tone for a few years and buy a few amps, you will save money by just getting the MKIIC and saving time and $ on overdriven, boosts, tubes, and various flavor of the month amps.

Just my two cents.

I owned a MKV for about a year. It was one of those bought chasing tone. It is almost great, but isn't a great MKIV, MKIIC, and the Edge mode is not British amp sounding IMO.

YMMV. Good luck on he tone quest.

Heritage Softail said:

The recto and any old Mark series will work. I have a rectoverb and MKIIC.

If you are going to be chasing the best possible tone out of the recto, boost it for tighter chug.

I have ran a recto with a DSL and MKIIC, it is indeed the great combination of two dissimilar but complimentary amps. It may be heresy to say on the Boogie Board, but borrow a Marshall tube head if you have to, and try it. The mid bark of the Marshall goes great with the scooped growl of the recto.

For a single amp to do Metallica, and I am a Metallica fan boy, it is the MKIIC. If you know you will chase tone for a few years and buy a few amps, you will save money by just getting the MKIIC and saving time and $ on overdriven, boosts, tubes, and various flavor of the month amps.

Just my two cents.

I owned a MKV for about a year. It was one of those bought chasing tone. It is almost great, but isn't a great MKIV, MKIIC, and the Edge mode is not British amp sounding IMO.

YMMV. Good luck on he tone quest.

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I actually have a tsl. I should try that in stereo with my mark.

As a new mark V owner, i'm in love.
I can get pretty damm near close to that metallica sound, but i need my 10 band eq added in the loop to do it. Without it not so much

I discovered 10W mode and the Mark V has edged ahead of my Mark III as my favorite amp.

Clips here https://soundcloud.com/dlpasco/sets/war-pigs-isolated-guitars

With channel 3 successfully conquered, the rest is just gravy. EL34s make channel 2 viable as well.

Just wanted to say, I've been listening to your 10W high-gain samples, and they sound pretty stellar to me! Good job there. 8)

What tubes/cab were you using btw? Mind sharing your exact settings?

LesPaul70 said:

Just wanted to say, I've been listening to your 10W high-gain samples, and they sound pretty stellar to me! Good job there. 8)

What tubes/cab were you using btw? Mind sharing your exact settings?

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Thank you very much

I'm using Mesa Boogie EL34s, and have the channel set to triode. I'm out of town this week, so I can't share the settings at the moment, but I don't think that they are anything particularly special. I'm using a fairly deep v on the graphic eq and have the first and last sliders up high - the bass slider is not quite as high as the treble slider is (sorry, I can't even look at the face place to see what frequencies they are).

When I get home I'll read them off and write up what they are.

I've been fortunate to play many Mesa models over the years...For instant Metallica tone, get a C+. That's it. Like someone said, you'll save time and money. If you can't afford one, then get a Mark 3. The 4 gets close, the Recto also, the 5, etc....But the C+ and 3 are what nail that old late 80's tone. The 4 in comparison is much darker, more preamp gain on tap. You can get the tone, but only within a narrow spectrum. With a C+ or 3, you get the tone easily.

Anyone using alternative preamp tubes, in the Mark V head? I had a 2013 Mark V (about a month ago. a "new" floor model), that easily and instantly dialed in a killer Black Album tone on the Mark IV setting. I nailed down the tone in seconds. I swapped it out for another (new in box 2014) after I noticed it had a big ding on the transformer housing. So my new head just does not have the same 3rd channel saturation. Sounds thinner. I'm using the same guitar, same cabinet, same cables, same room. I would take the head with the dinged up transformer back if I could. Any thoughts? Maybe try some other preamp tubes? I want the thickest, scooped saturation the Mark V can achieve. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Mullard CV4004 will give you some scooped tones. I have rolled though as many preamp tubes as I could, I have settled on loading amp with Mullard reissue and a CV4004 in V2 (thinking on putting back the vintage Mesa 12AX7a in there). However, I am not after a specific tone of any artist, so my goals may not be yours. The Mullard reissues can give you that similar sinister tone of the Mark IV.

Here are the settings I used for recording my 10 watt sounds. I'm in triode mode using Variac power, and the effects loop is enabled: