Why not try the G12-65 by celestion but USED?

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blaren

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I'm running my Ace head into a 1-12 cabinet that's loaded with one of what is probably my favorite speaker. An old Celestion G12-65. They can be had used relatively cheaply. IF you cant find any stand-alones, keep your eyes peeled for early JCM800 cabs (2-12 and 4-12). Some Marshall cabs were mislabeled though so don't automatically assume that if you see an old cab that says 260W, that it'll have the 65s. They clearly had left-over 260W placards left when they switched to the G12T-75s. Sometimes you'll open an old JCM800 cab that says 260W only to find 300W worth of the 75s :-( Guess Marshall went...hey at least we wont have any come back on warranty due to people putting a lot more than 260W into them...muahahaha.

The 65 is essentially a higher power handling capacity greenback. It sounds AWESOME (in a Stiletto) and can handle one (A Stiletto)..well a 50W..all by itself.

I haven't seen the reissue creambacks. I just sold a pair of '74 creambacks *G12M-25s"...and they are just a Greenback...which is a G12M-25. Green, Crème, Gray, and then black. All the same Rola Celestion G12M-25. Is the reissue different? Higher power capacity? Strange. The Greenback is 20w, creambacks are 25W, graybacks are 25W and some blackbacks are 25watters. Talking original/vintage spec here. The blackbacks were usually the G12H-30.

So now I know they have reissue greenbacks...some made in the UK and some made in China. They have G12H-30s in Heritage, Anniversary and whatever else series,,,a real blackback (G12H-30) is an inefficient speaker just like the greenback (sensitivity rating of around 96dB?) but that was about the only difference. A Blackback was a 30W version of a greenback and was usually used in the model 1982 cabs. They were rated at 120W and often called Bass cabs...and they could have been had with the 55Hz or 75Hz cones.
So again...the greenbacks (and gray and crème) and blackbacks were the same speaker but one could handle 25W and the other could handle 30w. Obviously you'll probably feel and hear some speaker breakup sooner with the greenbacks. I've always preferred the blackbacks. I sold that pair of '74 cream G12M-25s (greenbacks with crème backs...remember...the plastic mag covers were just that and Celestion was all over the place with them. A lot of them (combos especially) shipped without plastic mag covers.

SO yeah....NO idea what they're calling the creamback reissues. If they're period correct, they should be just a greenback with a different colored cap. AND....if it were ME...I wouldn't run one G12M-25 with my Stiletto Ace or 2 of them with my Deuce or 3 of them with my Trident. I'm sure..no I think it would be fine. Hey Marshall has been putting 4X25W spkrs in it's 100W cabs for a long time and feeding them with dimed 100W amps that are actually putting out closer to around 140W RMS. I still wouldn't risk it though. In fact, I wouldn't even put a G12H-30 with my Stiletto Ace. A pair of the 30W blackbacks....I wouldn't even risk a pair of my vintage blackbacks with the Stiletto Ace. I'm a chicken and I LOVE these spkrs and don't want to recone them.
So....enter the G12-65.
It is AWESOME! It sounds and acts like a greenback. They.....cont....EDIT: must be this site's "anti rant" software. When I get too ranty my comp starts to die. HA HA!!
Anyway yeah...it's harder to push the 65s into some speaker overdrive/distortion...which is fine by me.

Now for MORE good news...
I'm always stumped at how Reissue amps sell for more than the original. A case in point is an early '80s JCM800. A Canadian one with the laydown PT, EL34s, vert inputs and nice toggles. I can usually pick them up for under $500. I'll list them for about $850 and have trouble moving them. A couple years ago I was in a store with my wife. It was one fo those times when I had a MINT '82 2204 for sale for like $875. My wife goes...HEY SHANE...come look at THIS!! It's the SAME as yours...how much are you selling yours for? Cause this one is $2300!!! I go...oh yeah well this is a reissue of mine. See how it has the cheap plastic rocker switches? WAIT...so you have the REAL one...this is a "copy" and yet this one wants almost FOUR times as much as the real one????
Then she saw the Road Worn Strats on the wall and when I explained they were new but made to LOOK road worn...well I had to scrape her laughing *** off the floor. She had, within 10 minutes, lost complete faith in us guitar players...and I was embarrassed to say I was one.

Point is that there are plenty of outfits reproducing the good old Celestion spkrs. WGS, whatshisface with the expensive ones (cant remember brand of course...DOH!!) Weber, Emi and even Celestion. They're all even reproing G12-65. Welllll...ANY of them...old Greenbacks, Creambacks, graybacks, blackbacks...they can all be had used...with original cones...for LESS than the Reissues!!! Not always but pretty easily. Especially once you figure out that those other colors are often the exact same speaker. If they have green covers they fetch a premium. If it's gray, cream or black or uncovered...they get a lot less than the green covered ones.

So after all that nonsense....I guess this shoulda been all I needed to say...MY fave is the G12-65. It IS a greenback that'll handle 65W. The vintage ones are plentiful and cheap...cheaper often than the reissues.
Wattage has NOTHING to do with how loud a speaker is gonna be or seem. It's sensitivity rating tells how "loud" it is. I would not try a single (or even 2) 25W greenback with a 50W Stiletto. Nor would I want to damage one of my 30watters.

And don't forget about those sensitivity ratings either fellas. It's been a 37 year battle for me...gigging in bars refereeing the Armageddon that is volume vs tone. When you're a MArshall guy wanting that powersection to cook...you better have baffles, attenuators, beam blockers, variacs....lol using speakers with say a 96dB sensitivity rating will sound as loud with 100W pushing them as speakers with 100dB rating with 50W pushing them. The Stiletto is pretty marshallesque and I for one want the power section working. Using inefficient motors is a first step in the right direction.

Right now for me it's the Stiletto Ace with a 1-12 cab loaded with a G12-65. Step 1 complete. Now when parts arrive for the adj bias mod arrive and I toss some legit bottles in the powertube sockets...this thing is gonna BE a JTM45 (with rectifier sag) a JMP 50 with diode recto, a JCM800 2204, and a bit of a recto...kinda...almost. Or..in a nutshell, the amp that has killed my DSL gas and has made me stray from what I know, trust and love. So much so that...it has made me actually LIST my favorite amp. One I've had for YEARS!! My '73 JMP50 FIREBREATHER :-(
 
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