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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:12 pm 
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Mark I
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I've owned my Roadster for 8 years now but I'm embarrassed to say I mostly use channel 1 for clean and channel 4 for lead and rhythm. I haven't really explored the two other channels. I recently tried to dial up a similar lead sound on channel 3 minus some treble but to my surprise the two channels were very different. For some reason I though channels 3 and 4 were clones of each other. Can some one shed some light on the difference between 3 and 4? I can't get channel 3 even close to the sound I have in channel 4.

In the back both channels are set to 100 watts and set to Diode. In the front I'm using the modern mode on both channels. My gain on both channels is almost dimed as well. I can get a lot of treble out of channel 4 by turning up the treble and presence but on channel 3 I can't get anywhere near the same. It's like there is a blanket overtop of the speakers when I'm in channel 3. Very weird.

I would have expected these to be clones or at least very close to each other. Also does anyone know if the 3 and 4 are clones of each other on the Roadking 2? Thanks. Any comments would be greatly appreciated.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2017 6:26 pm 
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The channels are not clones, and the manual (pg 7) states that you need to turn the presence all the way up to match the lower range of presence in CH4.

I find the darker nature of CH 3's Modern a perfect lead tone platform to compliment the aggressive top end of CH 4 Modern, for me.

I think I read somewhere that CH 3 is optimized for Vintage mode, CH 4 is optimized for Modern mode.

AFAIK the Roadster shares the same preamp as the RKII.

Dom

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'07 Roadster Voodoo modded
'08 Stiletto Deuce II
'10 Mark V
'01 Recto 4X12 V30/Swamp Thang
'04 Recto 4X12 V30/Delta Pro 12A
'74 Les Paul Custom
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:55 am 
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Dual Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
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+1, Channel 3 and Channel 4 are not the same. If you really take note, there is some differences between CH1 and CH2. I found more bottom end voice on CH4 and CH2 in comparison to CH1 and CH3. If thick is a good term to use vs darker or warmer.

CH4 Modern is my favorite but also love the CH1 tweed with the gain maxed. To me it seems like this: CH1 has the least amount of gain, CH2 similar but also voiced a bit differently than CH1 since it has the brit circuit (doubt that has anything to contribute), CH3 has more gain than 1 and 2 but less than CH4. I am referring to nominal gain assuming all of the controls are set identical (approximate) to each other.

As for CH3 being more ideal for the Vintage voice, yes. Just try using the Vintage voice or raw on CH4 which is much darker in character. You may find that using CH3 at a different power setting may be rewarding for the lead vs CH4 in Modern. I was given that suggestion and it worked out great. The end result using CH4 modern for rhythm (100W) and CH3 Vintage (50W and tube rec). I threw it together quickly just to demo the tube recommendations that another forum user suggested. It is all in the description. My not be perfect but you get basic idea how the Vintage would sound as a lead tone. I typically use the CH4 modern all the time (lead and rhythm).

https://soundcloud.com/user-353100000/roadster1-zwav

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TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100
Old friends I sometimes miss:
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 7:10 am 
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Cool track, very AIC-ish.

Another example that the Recto's can get a great lead voice if you understand the amp & controls. I love how 'juicy' the Roadster can be, especially compared to the 'dryer' nature of the MKV.

IMO of course.

Dom

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'07 Roadster Voodoo modded
'08 Stiletto Deuce II
'10 Mark V
'01 Recto 4X12 V30/Swamp Thang
'04 Recto 4X12 V30/Delta Pro 12A
'74 Les Paul Custom
'12 Les Paul Signature T
Slinky's & Jazz III's
Voodoo Labs MIDI
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 1:58 pm 
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Mark I
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Thanks for the insight. I pretty much suspected everything you guys shared. I did quickly read through the manual but I guess I missed the part about the presence. I have to say I really love CH4's modern mode. I really wish it was cloned in CH3 or at least I wish I was able to dial up the same tone. I guess I could just pick up an Eq pedal. I've seen some videos for the boogie Eq pedal on line. It sounds great.

I've been playing my MKV for a few months now and although I do love it I still find myself playing the Roadster more. The MKV is so tight and percussive but the roadster just seems a bit more versatile. It's amazing what the Eq on the MKV can do for the amps sound and tone. When I turn it off the amp sound so different. I can't imagine what that Eq could do for the Roadster.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:41 pm 
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Mark III

Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:45 pm
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tzoranski wrote:
Thanks for the insight. I pretty much suspected everything you guys shared. I did quickly read through the manual but I guess I missed the part about the presence. I have to say I really love CH4's modern mode. I really wish it was cloned in CH3 or at least I wish I was able to dial up the same tone. I guess I could just pick up an Eq pedal. I've seen some videos for the boogie Eq pedal on line. It sounds great.

I've been playing my MKV for a few months now and although I do love it I still find myself playing the Roadster more. The MKV is so tight and percussive but the roadster just seems a bit more versatile. It's amazing what the Eq on the MKV can do for the amps sound and tone. When I turn it off the amp sound so different. I can't imagine what that Eq could do for the Roadster.


I case you are interested, Channel Cloning™ was first introduced on the Trem-O-Verb. The manual gives a good explanation of how it works: http://www.mesaboogie.com/media/User%20 ... moverb.pdf
I think the term may have fallen out of favor, but the concept is more or less the same as it applies to the Roadster, though, I suspect it has been refined a bit. I imagine Mesa/Boogie would be the people to ask. They should know. 8)


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:59 am 
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Dual Recto

Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:31 am
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Location: North Carolina
In essence CH3 and CH4 are twins but not identical twins. There is the solo control for jumping out if you need it too. Probably not the best choice of words to follow: CH3 is essentially the Dual rectifier in its character that retains all of the features the DR has to offer. Switching over to CH4 introduces a change in drive level and a darker image almost as if you added a Mark I into the mix. Similar statement could be made about CH1 and CH2 but the difference is not as apparent. Each channel has a different level of gain characteristic. CH1 being the least which provides the most overhead. CH2 is just a hair more gain. When you max out the gain in CH1 using tweed voice, you are at the low gain operating point of CH3 raw. I would say my only complaint about the Roadster is the difference in volume levels between the three voices of CH3 and CH4. The two clean channels do not seem to have the volume differences between their three voices. When using the other voices with CH3 or CH4 the channel master needs to be addressed to balance out the volume difference if one channel is using modern and the other using raw or vintage. I do this once in a great while, run through the factory settings in the manual to get refreshed. It has been a few years since I have looked at the Roadster manual. It is easy to get lost with the controls with this amp.

I have the Mesa 5BEQ pedal. I do not use it often but when I need a slight change in the tone it works great in the Roadster loop. The lead track on the short clip I used the EQ pedal in the loop. It can be fun to experiment with it. I have also done an inverted "v" and that seemed to work as a boost vs the standard V shape. Note that the preamp was loaded with non-stock tubes. I generally run mainly Mesa 12ax7a with the exception of V1 and V2 (tung sol or Mullard CV4004).

A good compressor/sustain pedal does wonders for the Roadster and improves harmonics. Best to shop around for a good one as some are very noisy. My preference is the Strymon OB.1 as it is transparent and adds little or no white noise or hiss to the amp signal chain. If you are considering putting anything on the front end, best to try it out first before buying as some can be very noisy.

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Current amps:
TC-50, JP-2C, MK V, Roadster, RA100
Old friends I sometimes miss:
Mk III (blue stripe), Mark IVb-WB


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2017 12:00 pm 
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Given To Fly wrote:
I case you are interested, Channel Cloning™ was first introduced on the Trem-O-Verb. The manual gives a good explanation of how it works: http://www.mesaboogie.com/media/User%20 ... moverb.pdf
I think the term may have fallen out of favor, but the concept is more or less the same as it applies to the Roadster, though, I suspect it has been refined a bit. I imagine Mesa/Boogie would be the people to ask. They should know. 8)


Actually, Channel Cloning was a standard feature on the 2 channel Recto when it was first released, although it was adopted into the Tremoverb as well.

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Boogie user of 20+ years, previous owner of 150+ Rectos, author of the previous "2 Channel Recto User Guide" and current "3 Channel Recto User Guide" (in progress).


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:15 pm 
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Mark III

Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:45 pm
Posts: 223
Silverwulf wrote:
Given To Fly wrote:
In case you are interested, Channel Cloning™ was first introduced on the Trem-O-Verb. The manual gives a good explanation of how it works: http://www.mesaboogie.com/media/User%20 ... moverb.pdf
I think the term may have fallen out of favor, but the concept is more or less the same as it applies to the Roadster, though, I suspect it has been refined a bit. I imagine Mesa/Boogie would be the people to ask. They should know. 8)


Actually, Channel Cloning was a standard feature on the 2 channel Recto when it was first released, although it was adopted into the Tremoverb as well.


You are right! On the original Dual Rectifier it is called "Channel Style Select" but on the Trem-O-Verb it is called "Channel Cloning™." I also think it only applies to 2 Channel Rectifiers which is a little counterintuitive now that we have the 4 channel Rectifiers (Roadster/Road King). Basically, everything I wrote in my previous was wrong. I apologize.

I think bandit2013's analogy for the Roadster's 3rd and 4th Channels, "twins, but not identical twins," captures the concept with the most accuracy.


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