why does the early 3 channel rectifier not get any love ??

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seems like on some of the web sites I'm on , Mesa guy's don't like the early 3 channel DR compared to any of 2 channel recto's or late model DR's ..... is there a good reason for this ??...... I'm about a year into a used early 3 channel recto I got that had Eurotubes favorite tube combo installed with KT77's when I got it ..... like it so much I hardly play my MK V but at the same time I have never played any other Recto's ...... was thinking about another DR for back up , is there any certain DR's I should be on the hunt for ???
 
Opinions are free and in great supply. If the owner loves it, that's what matters. I love mine. I'd hate to replace it. All it needed was a loop mod to be absolutely perfect for me and it was already **** close to perfect when stock.

When it comes to opinions and the Internet, a massive grain of salt is necessary. Besides, let people talk out of their butts all they want, it'll drop the price enough that you can buy another one. The only thing better than one DR is two DRs. LOL
 
I guess one of the main reasons why that model caught so much flak was related to the fact that it changed the established Recto tone. No matter how good an amp is, that is a guaranteed way to irk people. While the newer 3-channel Dual still offers a (modified) version of the 3-channel Recto tone, it also offers a number of distinct improvements (most notably, a serial effects loop and a multi-watt switch) so it is generally better accepted.

Personally, I find that 2-channel Rectifiers (all versions) sound warmer and more organic than the newer 3-channels ones - or the 4-channel ones (Roadster, Road King), for that matter. YMMV. But they all sound like Rectifiers, so everybody wins in the end.
 
I have a first series 3 channel dual rec. I love it. It does exactly what I want it to do. I've had it 10 years and I think its about 15-16 years old and it has been 100% reliable. Never had an issue, even back in the day when I was doing some serious gigging with it.
 
In regards to the sound: To make a significant change in the sound of a 3 Channel to make it more like a Rev F, the presence pot for Channel 3 could be changed to 25k. It isn't perfect, but it gets a Vintage sound of Orange cloned to Red closer to the older models, but without dual Presence controls. It also makes the treble roll off/presence circuit for Modern exactly like the older ones. As designed, Modern on Channel 2 is the mode most like the older models, but with a brighter sound.

The old circuit for Vintage was R22k-C.003-R10k, which is sort of like the treble response of 3 Ch Modern Channel 2 with the Presence at 11:00. The 3 Channel changed it to R33k-C.003 on Channel 2. I suspect the relays wouldn't allow the additional 10k to change taper of the treble roll off and have the other modes work correctly.

Increasing R sets the roll off higher and would be similar in sound, but it isn't doing the same thing. The 2 Ch had a longer roll off to retain some highs, giving the Presence control more to work with. The 3 Ch moved the roll off and it is a normal RC filter with -20dB/decade.

This isn't a better/worse scenario. It's just different. Even if no there is no desire to change anything, it's an illustration of what makes them different. I'm personally ok with it, as I don't use Vintage a lot and I like having two versions of Modern and Raw.
 
Cause of all the s**t talking about them on forums. I think most of that noise comes from bedroom players who have no idea what that amp is capable of in a band situation. I have an older 3 channel and a friend has a newer multi watt, at stage volumes the difference in tone and feel is subtle at best. I find all of the nitpicking about amps that goes on @ HC or TGP to be ridiculous. I sound how I sound through any amp that has enough gain on tap to get me where I like to be lead wise. I've used a Lonestar, the dreaded JCM 900, 5150's, a Mark III and two different Dual Recto's in the band I'm in and I always sound basically like me. I can tell the difference at home playing quietly by myself but in the band a punch in the face from a hundred watt amp is what it is. If you can't make any of those amps sound good when they are running at the volume they are designed to run at then that's a case user error, not design flaws. The fx loop in the older 3 channel is a real concern for some people based on what they put through it but I've never had a problem with what I use for pedals.
 
Personally, I have 8 Rectos. While most of them (7) are older 2 channel models, ranging from a very early Rev C to a first run Single Recto, I have a 2001 Mesa Triple Rectifier I keep in my stash as well.

That being said, I absolutely don't need it. I have 7 others. But, I keep it around because it offers a different tone than the others. People will always complain about certain aspects of certain amps. The parallel loop, for example, is not an issue for me. I've used them with rack processors, floor pedals from modern ones to vintage analog delays, etc...and never had an issue with any pedal, in any rig, in any situation. I set the FX return to 100% wet and I'm done. Contrary to what the Internet will tell you, I've never experienced any dry bleed issues on any Mesa amp I've owned, and that includes the couple I have now.

I bought a first run 3 channel Triple back in 2000-2001. Enjoyed them then, still enjoy them now, despite the rest in my stash.
 
destropiate said:
Cause of all the s**t talking about them on forums. I think most of that noise comes from bedroom players who have no idea what that amp is capable of in a band situation. I have an older 3 channel and a friend has a newer multi watt, at stage volumes the difference in tone and feel is subtle at best. I find all of the nitpicking about amps that goes on @ HC or TGP to be ridiculous. I sound how I sound through any amp that has enough gain on tap to get me where I like to be lead wise. I've used a Lonestar, the dreaded JCM 900, 5150's, a Mark III and two different Dual Recto's in the band I'm in and I always sound basically like me. I can tell the difference at home playing quietly by myself but in the band a punch in the face from a hundred watt amp is what it is. If you can't make any of those amps sound good when they are running at the volume they are designed to run at then that's a case user error, not design flaws. The fx loop in the older 3 channel is a real concern for some people based on what they put through it but I've never had a problem with what I use for pedals.

I was actually going to say similar things, without disparaging bedroom players. When I play with a loud drummer (my ex-step-son or my brother in my music room) the tone is beastly and my "bedroom volume" is often not much lower, but between a past career and current disability, I couldn't actually play out with it.

Perhaps the point, which I've seen many times, is to not expect the performance at quiet volumes to be great and how EQ settings for low and high volumes to not translate from one situation to the other.

-----
The thing with low volume playing is that the Output control has a RC filter to allow highs to pass more easily when the control is at 10:00 or lower. This treble "bleed" circuit get more bright as a person turns down the control, just the same as when it's used on a guitar. If a person can go without the loop and doesn't use all three channels, the hard bypass of the loop might help. The master volume controls do not have treble bleeds.

Alternatively, I found that using the Solo as a volume control de-emphasizes the treble bleed.
 
APEMAN said:
...because:

2) the amp has been redesigned to meet the need of the new metal players (low tunings) and the amp sounds fantastic with e.g. a baritone guitar. RS stated in an interview the power amp has been pushed to perform one octave deeper.

Octave division goes back to the 70s. Also, a guitar produces a small octave down harmonic which a 6L6GC will exploit by its low end response.
6) the clean channel is not clean.......

Mine is pretty clean; It just doesn't sparkle.
7) there are certain muddy and piercing frequencies you will never be able to dial out.

That just isn't true.
9) it sounds totally different then the recto sounds you expect from recordings (early 2CH revision C models or marks)
First, who's talking about Marks? Second, that vast majority of 2 CH Rectos are not Rev C. For example Soundgarden would have been using Rev F or Rev G for Superunknown. Monster Magnet used Rev G from Superjudge to God Says No. The only recording I'm absolutely sure is a Rev C is AICs Dirt, but it's mixed with Bogners and Marshalls. They only wanted the low end from it.
10) channel switching will always pop.
Not if you cycle through channels a few times while in standby.
11) it is biased (to north pole conditions) very cold.
I think all of them are; Certainly from Rev F on. It allows the power amp to color the sound without being responsible for clipping dynamics. That way, with preamp distortion, a person can vary overall volume from gig to gig without losing their core sound.
13) its high gain area is designed for very loud low tuned rythm playing, not for good standalone sounds
I disagree, because I get a multitude of sounds from mine, including a lead tone I am happy with.
 
Silverwulf said:
Contrary to what the Internet will tell you, I've never experienced any dry bleed issues on any Mesa amp I've owned, and that includes the couple I have now.

Well, I can tell that the dry bleed issue is definitely more than an Internet myth, I can clearly hear it on two different amps I have - a RevG Dual (which has a parallel loop) and a Mark V (which has a serial loop).

However, that is an issue only when playing at home (low overall volume). You get a sort of quacky out-of-phase chorus effect. But at band volume, especially with a band, you don't hear it. At least I don't, nor do my bandmates.
 
The first version 3ch Rectifiers work great for me. No complaints whatsoever.
 
AFU, I didn't mean that as a rip on all bedroom players. Most of my practicing and playing is done quietly at night in a bedroom. I just get annoyed at how many posts there are ripping on the tone of the 3 channel Rectifiers. I honestly believe that a lot of it comes from guys who buy them, take them home and then are dissatisfied that they can't get "insert band name here" tone playing solo and very quietly. The older 3 channels are awesome amps. They record well, have a huge range of useable tones and sound great when you get the chance to let them breathe. There's a reason why they are one of the most popular amps out there for rock and metal guys. When people say stuff like "the only good tone is on channel two orange" or "the clean sucks" etc its obvious that either they have not read the manual or simply never turn the amp up loud enough to get it sounding g its best.
 
destropiate said:
AFU, I didn't mean that as a rip on all bedroom players. Most of my practicing and playing is done quietly at night in a bedroom. I just get annoyed at how many posts there are ripping on the tone of the 3 channel Rectifiers. I honestly believe that a lot of it comes from guys who buy them, take them home and then are dissatisfied that they can't get "insert band name here" tone playing solo and very quietly. The older 3 channels are awesome amps. They record well, have a huge range of useable tones and sound great when you get the chance to let them breathe. There's a reason why they are one of the most popular amps out there for rock and metal guys. When people say stuff like "the only good tone is on channel two orange" or "the clean sucks" etc its obvious that either they have not read the manual or simply never turn the amp up loud enough to get it sounding g its best.

I didn't take it personally and I agree with that.
 
APEMAN said:
And I think there are far easier amps out there... so it leeds us to the questions: What makes your old 3CH the best amp in the world for you... ? Why do you prefer the 3CH over a 2CH or anything else?
:roll:

I didn't say best amp in the world. I said it is perfect for me. Tone is subjective, so your opinion is just as valid as mine in regards to how it sounds, but I happen to really like it and it pairs perfectly with my playing style. If it was lost to me, I would get a Reborn for the added features, but I can't justify the additional cost at the moment and I am very happy with what I have.
 
Silverwulf said:
I've seen jazz and country players gigging with 3 channel Rectos. It's certainly not a one trick pony.

Saw James Brown, his guitarist was using a 2 channel Triple.

Adam from Maroon 5 uses dual rec's

A lot of punk bands/Indie Rock bands use them, examples Fall out boys earlier albums, New Found Glory, 2nd and 3rd album and All time low and many more bands.

Many
 
thanks guys for the insight ..... I bought mine and it had KT77's in it , love the sound but have never heard it with 6L6's either , this is my second Mesa ( and not last) , first DR and my favorite between my MK V and DR , but I haven't played any other recto's either ,
 
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