So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

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groovebelly
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So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by groovebelly » Tue Oct 13, 2015 12:37 pm

New ROV s2 combo owner here... Parallel loop
Also have an Ace head with series loop...
Both recommend 3ft or less loop cables and "Professional quality" effects in the loop...

What brands are high quality? What is close enough?

How do you control your foot pedal when it's sitting on top of your head b/c of the 3' cables?

Are there effects with separate foot controllers? Is Mesa recommending rack only level effects?

I really haven't minded my TC Nova Repeater in my Stiletto loop with 6-10' cables...
What am I missing?
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kdorsey
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by kdorsey » Tue Oct 13, 2015 2:06 pm

I've run 40' of cable for the loop without any serious degradation. Don't fret the cable length.

Matching a specific effect to a specific amp's loop is always a chore. Much of it is trial and error, honestly. It's about matching level, impedance, etc. and much of that info isn't published. The best info comes from others with the exact same amp...which I don't. But, typically, digital multi effects units tend to be a little more noisy so be sure to feed clean power to both the amp and pedals with a power conditioner/regulator.

In certain applications, I've really liked the Strymon boxes (El Capistan and Flint) in both the loop and up front on my vintage amps.
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screamingdaisy
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by screamingdaisy » Tue Oct 13, 2015 7:27 pm

If a device lists something -10dBu in it's specs it's an instrument level device and is designed for use before the preamp.

If a device lists something like +4dBu in its specs it's a line level device and is designed for use in an effects loop.

If you go back in time a bit most amps didn't have effects loops. People would buy a Boss DD-3 and use it in front of their Marshall and it sounded great.

Then someone would buy a Mesa and stick a DD-3 in the loop and it would sound like ass. Back then pedals were typically instrument level and you pretty much had to buy a rack effect to get line level.

Things have changed and you can get well made line level pedals that work fine in the loop.

As for only using three feet of cable... That works great when everything is mounted in a rack with a midi switching system. For the rest of us, just try to keep the cables as short as is reasonable. I use a pair of 15' leads.
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mkVplayer
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by mkVplayer » Tue Oct 13, 2015 10:54 pm

screamingdaisy wrote:If a device lists something -10dBu in it's specs it's an instrument level device and is designed for use before the preamp.

If a device lists something like +4dBu in its specs it's a line level device and is designed for use in an effects loop.

If you go back in time a bit most amps didn't have effects loops. People would buy a Boss DD-3 and use it in front of their Marshall and it sounded great.

Then someone would buy a Mesa and stick a DD-3 in the loop and it would sound like ass. Back then pedals were typically instrument level and you pretty much had to buy a rack effect to get line level.

Things have changed and you can get well made line level pedals that work fine in the loop.

As for only using three feet of cable... That works great when everything is mounted in a rack with a midi switching system. For the rest of us, just try to keep the cables as short as is reasonable. I use a pair of 15' leads.
What's a good line level pedal for echo and reverb, anybody?

I have an old Boss RV3 (http://www.bossus.com/products/rv-3/) but I'm not sure about the impedance or whatever that dBu measurement is, and I assume there must be something better out now anyhow. I have a TC Nova System that works great with the Mark V but I'd like something smaller for a Studio .22+, for echo mainly, but a hall reverb would be nice too.

Actually I have a Boss LS2 also which looks like it could lower the voltage going into the echo pedal since it has level controls (from -infinity to +20) that control the two loops the LS2 itself has, not sure about the return from it back to the amp though. Probably Boss's typical (high) buffered output?
http://www.bossus.com/products/ls-2/
Then again once I have both of these pedals and all the cables involved I'd probably be better off with the Nova. :(

So back to the original question I guess... what's a good line level delay and reverb pedal?

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screamingdaisy
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by screamingdaisy » Wed Oct 14, 2015 2:21 am

I use a Strymon El Capistan for delay.

No idea about reverb. I use the one built into my amp.
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KiwiJoe
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by KiwiJoe » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:08 pm

I run a Boss DD-7 in the (series) loop of my Mini Rec. Works great, no noise, no worries. If the device has an output level control that helps. As for reverb, I don't know. I've heard that the TC Electronics Hall of Fame is quite good.
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groovebelly
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by groovebelly » Mon Oct 19, 2015 10:54 pm

So we're really just after line level efx, that is straight forward
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Given To Fly
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Re: So what exactly is a "pro-quality" effects loop effect?

Post by Given To Fly » Thu Oct 22, 2015 7:51 pm

The Eventide Factor pedals can all be set to Line Level which is a really great feature. They work great in Mesa Boogie FX Loops. Ironically, the Eventide H9 can not be set to Line Level, only instrument level, but it still sounds great through Mesa Boogie FX Loops. (Assuming the FX Loop is a Serial Loop; Parallel Loops can be finicky.) I'm not sure what is considered "non-professional quality" other than pedals you probably wouldn't put in an FX Loop to begin with.

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