Roadster in large room, ended up in EQ hell!

I finally was able to get my roadster combo out of my house and into a large room to play with some friends, and frankly I was quite frustrated with it. I knew going in that there would be some sound differences with the acoustics of the room changing but it was much more extreme than I had thought. It sounded like a blanket was thrown over the amp and the bass was wayyyyy too high.

Just to try to get the thing under control, I went from 50w on each channel to 100w, put all settings to noon and began tweaking from there. Right off the bat I cut bass and gain. Channel 1 set on clean was breaking up much earlier than expected and majorly lacked clarity at higher volumes. I ended up going to "tweed" which seemed to help a bit.

Channel 3 on vintage seemed to develop the "recto fizz" at higher volume that wasn't there at a lower volume, I cut my gain down to around 9 o'clock and

This lead to my next problem...I now know why people say people spend more time tweaking knobs than playing their amps when it comes to Mesas! I tried to get a clean channel (channel 1) and my vintage channel (channel 3) set with a decent volume level but kept struggling with volume normalization and tone to the point where I just used the clean channel with pedals instead. Mesas EQ style can be quite a chore to dial in.

Anyone got any tips for me? I would really prefer not to disable the loop, as I use my DL4, Corona Chorus and Ditto Looper in it, but am willing to if its necessary.

The first things coming to mind:

If you increased volume, the mids will also need to be increased a little.
Spend time at home getting the sounds at the volume you intend to use. Write them down.
People do this differently, but I almost always set the clean channel first to keep it clean. It's easier for me to set a dirt channel a little higher than to set clean a little lower.
Decouple it from the floor to control the bass response. You could tilt your combo up, too.
Forget conventional amp settings. The Bass and Presence are like salt and pepper. A little is good. Moderate is fine. A lot will choke you.

What speakers are in the combo and what are your settings? In a bigger room you would have to elevate your amp and point it towards the ears of everyone not to get lost.

It would help if you posted your settings. It'd give us a baseline to work from.

Also, your location within a room and it's proximity to a wall or corner, as well as the construction of the floor will all influence the sound. Sometimes moving your cab over a foot or two will help clear up the boom, as will elevating it off the floor.

As for volume normalization from clean to dirty, I usually find it works better if there's a volume boost when switching to distortion. Clean tones are typically clear and dynamic, which helps them to cut through much better that compressed and distorted tones. If the two tones are normalized you'll end up with a clean that's too loud and a distortion that sounds small and weak.

afu said:

Forget conventional amp settings.

Click to expand...

This is by far and a mile the best advice ever given by anyone to anyone for dialing in Mesa amps. When I read (the OP) that you set everything to 12 noon and started over, I knew you were doomed from the start. That tactic only works on "normal" amps.

I don't want distortion or heavy crunch, I emphasize clean sustain and smooth overdrive, so you'll have to modify my suggestion to your own needs. I learned to start with everything set to off, full ccw, all tone knobs and all gain knobs.

Turn all master volumes up at least half way, 2 or 3 o'clock if you are in a place where you can crank it.

I start with the clean. Turn the gain up to 1, or 7 o'clock. Then strum while slowly turning up the bass just barely enough to give you a modest low end. Then slowly turn up the mid to 7 or 8 o'clock, followed by the high to 7 or 8 o'clock. If it isn't loud at all, slowly turn the gain up to 8 or even 9 o'clock.

At this point I would get the volume level I want by turning up the gain, before I turn the tone knobs up any more.

Repeat for the higher gain channels. Just remember to use a lot of master, a modest amount of gain, and as little tone knobs as necessary. Try to get your desired sound with the tone knobs as far ccw as possible but still having the tone and body you want. If you have your tone knobs all at 12 noon or higher, you have gone waaaaaaaaayyyyyyy tooooooo far past the mark.......

soundchaser59 said:

afu said:

Forget conventional amp settings.

Click to expand...

This is by far and a mile the best advice ever given by anyone to anyone for dialing in Mesa amps. When I read (the OP) that you set everything to 12 noon and started over, I knew you were doomed from the start. That tactic only works on "normal" amps.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the compliment. I do have a slightly different version of your advice for a person who is using distortion.

The way I hear the amp, its focus rests on the octave from around 550 Hz to 1100 Hz (and A = 880 is in the middle). This octave is also the upward curve of the EQ from the natural mid cut of the tone stack. By turning off the bass and presence, that octave is dominant and the basic setting can be had with the mid and treble; distortion is set to taste. If the bass and presence are then introduced, the amp can be set in minutes instead of hours. I turn those controls until it's too much and then back off a little bit.

There are many ways to approach it. Different courses for different horses.

First completely forget about being in a small or large room and figure out how all the controls interact when raising or lowering the overall volume of the amp. This should take a few weeks to really do. No one could do that in a matter of minutes.

All amps change when you change the overall volume.... Some more than others.

Personally I do not turn up or down the volume of my amp regardless of the size of the room. I play at the same volume as my drummer without a mic. But I am very familiar with how my amps react to different volumes..... From TV volumes to cranked.

When in different size rooms or rooms with different acoustics the only thing you usually need to change is bass and presence...... And usually these should not be changed much at all..... If at all.

Sell the combo. Buy a head and a 4x12 and be done with it.

Here's my take: https://warpedmusician.wordpress.com/2015/09/05/the-fmv-tone-stack-and-dual-rectifier/

I hope it helps.

Thanks for all the replies so far guys. We played again on Friday, but this time I took my rectoverb 25 head and 1x12 recto cab and had a much easier time!

As far as the roadster settings, I'll go snap some pics and post them up. I am aware of how the tone stack of the amp works, I guess i will just need to work on EQing at much higher volumes, as my office at home is a 12x12 room so things do sound completely different.

As far as the suggestion of swapping the combo for a head and 4x12 cab, being that the other player uses a hot rod deluxe that might make things a bit lopsided!

Generally, I tend to use less gain than a lot of other people and I don't use pickups that are all that hot. That gives me the option to hit any one of the channels with a little clean boost or light OD to add gain and tighten up the channel. Unlike a lot of people, I don't mind starting at noon and fiddling from there. I really don't pay much attention to the numbers, I just turn the knob until it sounds right. Sometimes a small change can make a huge difference, other times you can turn the knob a significant amount and not hear much of a change.




I run my roadster head into a cab with greenbacks, so I doubt my settings will help you much.
Ch 1. Tweed 11, 11, 11, 1, 1, 4
Ch 2. Clean 2, 1, 12, 11, 3, 12
Ch 3. Raw 3, 9, 9, 9, 2, 12
Ch 4. Vintage 1, 12, 11, 11, 11, 11
Values reflect position on a clock, changing master volume drastically changes some of the channel volumes and requires some re-balancing.