Mini Rectifier tube suggestions

Hi,

I'm in the process of debugging massive hum / noise / EMI / RF interference on Channel 2 25w with high gain (> 1 o'clock) and Master at about 9 o'clock. Yes, I understand that's a lot of gain.

For the sake of argument, let's assume the problem is one or more bad tubes. What is the general consensus on replacement preamp and power tubes for each position? Basically, better than stock for the MR. High gain, low noise, great tone and clarity. For what it's worth, I do not need clean headroom on this amp.

I notice it's common to put a TungSol in V1 and leave the rest Mesa-branded JJ 12AX7 and EL84. Is this still a thing?

Thanks very much.

Ent said:

...I notice it's common to put a TungSol in V1 and leave the rest Mesa-branded JJ 12AX7 and EL84. Is this still a thing?

Click to expand...

From what I've read that seems to be the consensus of those who have done some tube rolling and appear to know what they're talking about.

Ive moved to Ruby 12AX7 HG+ in V1 and V2. V3-V5 is stock.

I find them good. Supposed to be tested for low noise and microphonics. Supposedly these are what Deizel use in the V1 and V2 of their amps.

Personally, I never hear a difference between a tungsol, JJ, sovtek, or shungang. They all sound the same to me. I guess my ears are as sensitive as other. Then again, I really dont use my CH1 all that much.

I just look more for reliability.

Thanks for the replies.

This may sound like a stupid question, but is there any real difference between the Mesa-branded JJs (available from MB's site and a few other places) and just straight up JJs (via, say, Musician's Friend)? Manufacturing considerations, noise level, reliability, tone, animal abuse, black magic, etc?

The only difference that I know of is that Mesa tubes are tested by Mesa and meet their test and criteria. Other online distributors have their own testing and criteria.

The other issue is that if you decide to use "non" branded Mesa tubes it voids your warranty (if Mesa finds out). Make sure to hang on to the originals and replace them if you ever need to send it back.

Hey Ent,

I did some tube rolling on my Mini and came upon the combo that you mention. Tungsol in V1, V2-V4 stock Mesa/JJ 12AX7 and swap the EL84 from Mesa/Sovtek to JJ's.

The EL84's added more mid range punch and removed the somewhat "dead" character of the Sovteks. The Tungsol tube removed a bit of harshness and, to me, has a somewhat more scooped EQ curve when compared to JJ's so I liked that on this amp. I ended up with a more scooped preamp section and a more punchy, mid emphasized power section.

So far my experience with preamp tubes goes like this:

• Tungsols: scooped and tight.
• JJ: rugged with mid emphasis.
• Mullard RI: bassy and a bit looser.
• Sovtek WA: crappy and fizzy.
• Sovtek LPS: more hi-fi sounding, less "hair".
• Raytheon blackplates: trebly and less gain.

I think the noise is there no matter what tubes you put in where. It is probably a byproduct of the circuit design. I have given up elminating the hiss and decided to use an isp noise gate in the loop. That took care of everythng.

+1
Volume + gain is going to give you noise. The more volume and gain the higher the noise floor will be.

The only time my rig is 100% quiet is when I have my guitar muted with my tuner. Otherwise, noise is present on CH2 Modern.

I tried using an ISP Gstring for both my Rectoverb and Mini and that worked well but introduced a ground loop hum when the pedal was not on. Then I found trying to eliminate the Ground loops was much for frustrating to figure out than just accepting noise.

As mentioned, if you want a silent rig you will need to go with 1 to 2 noise gates or a ISP Pro Rack Decimator.

I'm sorry if I came off like I was looking for a quick fix by retubing. The question was more for my education in the event I needed to retube for any reason, whether that be in 3 days or 3 years.

As for my noise problem, it's pretty frustrating. I'm not sure what the normal level of noise is for the MR and I could be overreacting. I can confirm that the noise isn't being caused by one particular cable, pedal, or guitar.

With nothing plugged into the amp and all electronics in the room unplugged:
- 10w on both channels hums.
- 25w on both channels is hissy.
- Both problems exist with the loop on and off, though it is slightly amplified with the loop on.
- Both problems are magnified on Modern mode. The extreme example is 25w Modern with Gain at 3 o'clock and Master at 9 o'clock. I understand how loud and gainy that is for home recording. But for argument's sake, lets say I'm playing with a band and a very loud drummer.
- The amp will feed back using the above settings, even with nothing plugged in.

I have two Decimators and they clean up the noise wonderfully. The only problem I have with them is there is some bleeding of noise just before the gate closes. It's very noticable when playing staccato or fast-muted chords. I can only describe it as noise artifacts: Notenoise | Silence | Notenoise | Silence |. It makes getting a good recording almost impossible. I can sort of mask the problem by using a bit of reverb or delay, but that seems hacky.

I found a pretty good representation of my noise on Youtube. I don't know this guy or use that gear, but I do know that noise!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6SYpXPslDI

Just to be clear, it's my responsibility to do due diligence and investigate all my options like an adult, rather than crying "waaaa noisy amp". I'm not looking for an easy fix and am willing to spend as much time as necessary to fix this problem. For all I know, my house could have been wired by a crazy person. I wouldn't be surprised.

My todo list is:
- Check the grounding on all outlets.
- Hunt for ground loops. I found a very minor one last night. It didn't fix my problem, but it was satisfying to correct that.
- Eliminate every single source of interference in my 3 story house.
- Demo a Rocktron Hush, Electro Harmonix Hum Debugger, and a Furman conditioner. I hate throwing money at a problem, though.
- Bring the amp to a Mesa authorized repairperson and demo the problem for him. I want to hear "normal", or "wow, that's a problem".
- Learn to live with it and get creative in my DAW to try and mask / edit out the noise.

Thanks again, and sorry about the length of this post.

Concerning the hum in 10 watt without nothing plugged in...Talked to a guy at Mesa and this hum has something to do with the switching from pentode/triode...

I have it with my MR too and was worried,but now I Know...

No hum in 25 watt setting.

Hey folks,

I was searching here in forums for a solution to my MR 25 hum/hiss problem and found the bellow description to be equal as mine:

With nothing plugged into the amp and all electronics in the room unplugged:
- 10w on both channels hums.
- 25w on both channels is hissy.
- Both problems exist with the loop on and off, though it is slightly amplified with the loop on.
- Both problems are magnified on Modern mode. The extreme example is 25w Modern with Gain at 3 o'clock and Master at 9 o'clock. I understand how loud and gainy that is for home recording. But for argument's sake, lets say I'm playing with a band and a very loud drummer.
- The amp will feed back using the above settings, even with nothing plugged in.

Click to expand...

I wonder if any of you found a solution for this problem.

I double checked my house eletrics and it´s ok. Tried out another tube amp (Marshall like) in the crunch channel and no problems at all.

I took the amp to a repair shop and the guy there told me that he listened to this very problem in another MR 25. In this very occasion he had another MR 25 and showed me the same hum problem. He said there´s no fix to it.

Is there, by any chance, some solution to this problem, even it envolves some circuitry mod?

I simply can´t stand the ******* noise! :evil:

Any help will be much appreciated!

André

Addictedtokaos said:

Ive moved to Ruby 12AX7 HG+ in V1 and V2. V3-V5 is stock.

I find them good. Supposed to be tested for low noise and microphonics. Supposedly these are what Deizel use in the V1 and V2 of their amps.

Personally, I never hear a difference between a tungsol, JJ, sovtek, or shungang. They all sound the same to me. I guess my ears are as sensitive as other. Then again, I really dont use my CH1 all that much.

I just look more for reliability.

Click to expand...

Tube swap definitely do change tone of any amp, but you will only be able to tell the difference if you previously have had lots of ear training sessions and experimentation, otherwise...