Best 6L6s for MK III Simul outer sockets - recommendations?

[herrball]

While I love the sound of 6L6s mixed with EL34s in my MK III Simul/Blue stripe, lately my gigs have driven me to use my MK III in the 15 watt mode which is still plenty loud for small clubs. I also enjoy being able to push the tubes harder rather than rely on just the preamp distortion.

With that as the backdrop, and knowing that Mesa recommends EL34s in the outer sockets ( I'm guessing these are biased hotter? I'm not a techie) which 6L6s handle the hotter bias better? My preference in lower wattage settings for power tube breakup is 6L6s so I'd like to pop some in for small gigs.

Thoughts/experience/recommendations appreciated and BTW.....Happy Holidays to all......

 

[cremona]

Philips, sylvania, Mesa 415 STR,(same tube) thise where the tubes mesa used stock for the mark II and III (not sure about mark 1), After philips stoped making them mesa was forced to to find another trube manufactore , but the kvality suffered and the started recormending el34`s for the mark III.

The 415 str`s are proberly the most reliable 6l6 tube ever consived , there expected life time is 10.000 houres.
I dont have the correct specs, but the are can take a beating.

Philips alos made a military version of the 415 called the 7581A , same construcvtion tube but the are rated 35 watts , and the 415 str is 30 watt tube.
Thise tubes where put through the most extreme tests to insure the could liv up to the military standard.

I dont have the 7581a enymore but the 415 str`s , I regret letting go of those 7581a`s because the do sound a bit better then the 415 .

But ither 6l6 tube will be the best choice for the mark III

I

 

[SonicProvocateur]

STR-415s is what I use. They are also called STR-387s. It depends on what manufacturer they were made for. They were all made by Sylvania on the on the (last) Philips tooling machines specifically for Boogie and Fender, although Groove Tube did get their hands on a few batches. Monster dual halo getters. Sweet tones for miles and built like tanks, they idle when i'm cranking full power.

Best modern production tube? Most will defend the Svetlana =C=, although I have not personally used them. I myself prefer the ElectroHarmonix 6L6EH, it's super powerful and is definitely very modern sounding. It doesn't sound like a vintage tube. The EHX tubes seem to get chewed up a bit faster though. Not as fast as Ruby crap though. I'll never use a chinese 6L6 again.

 

[MrMarkIII]

Here's some reviews from the Tube Depot, an online tube seller. Just tell them, or any of the other sellers, what amp you have and they can fix you up.
http://tubedepot.com/6l6reviews.html

The Mark III manuals from the mid-90s did indeed recommend against using 6L6s in the outer sockets, but that was due to poor quality 6L6s available at the time. That's no longer a specific problem, although there does seem to be a general consensus that any and all current production tubes are suspect. Of course, everyone has their personal horror stories.
The best info I have is that the Russian Electro-Harmonix 6L6 EH is the same tube Mesa used to sell as the STR-430. Mesa now sells the STR-440, equivalent to the JJ or Ruby brands. They are Chinese (Shuguang 6L6GCMSTR).
My personal preferences are NOS STR-450s (RFT/Siemens) in the outer, and STR-454s (original Svetlana =C= Winged C) in the inner sockets.
I find the 430s break up earlier than the 440s, and the 440s are glassier and stiffer sounding, with even more bottom end. The 440s are closer to the STR-415s. IMO.
If you must have that spanky clean Fender blackface Twin sound, get the 415s or 440s. The 430s or EH are excellent, too.
When I have my blue stripe Simul switched to "Class A", I actually prefer the sound of the EL-34s, so there you go.
Just pop the 6L6s you have already in the outer sockets and see how they work. You can leave the inner sockets empty if you leave the switch on "Class A".
It's hard to kill a Boogie.
Another option to try is plugging the 8 ohm speaker into the 4 ohm jack. This lowers the output power and smoothes the tone somewhat.

 

[SonicProvocateur]

MrMarkIII is right about the STR-440's sounding closer to the STR-415s, but those are different from an off the shelf Ruby. Keep that in mind. They are mushier sounding I might add, with way more mids (not in a good way, i'd say. Sloshier and less precise than the MSTR and the ones chosen by Boogie). You are right about the Chinese tubes having more bass, but the EH/430s are much much tighter to my ears...or maybe just the ones I got lol.

 

[dodger916]

MrMarkIII is right about the STR-440's sounding closer to the STR-415s, but those are different from an off the shelf Ruby. Keep that in mind. They are mushier sounding I might add, with way more mids (not in a good way, i'd say. Sloshier and less precise than the MSTR and the ones chosen by Boogie). You are right about the Chinese tubes having more bass, but the EH/430s are much much tighter to my ears...or maybe just the ones I got lol.

I agree the 440 is closer to the 415 than the 430 is, but I think the =C= is closer yet.

Just a head's up: you might need to be aware of the tubes you run in the Class A sockets. I know with the C+ and a 105 tranny, only Mesa Reds are suitable for those sockets. I'm not familiar with Mark IIIs, so maybe someone else can supply info on that. Being that MrMarkIII didn't say anything, I suspect it's not an issue (he's very knowledgable and thorough).

 

[MrMarkIII]

Thanks, flattery will get you everywhere!
Yeah, I've run just about every color in the outer sockets, they're not picky.

 

[sevenchaos]

I've been happy with Svetlana's winged -c-'s or JJ's.
I've been using both of those with combination 6l6's & el34's.
JJ's are little bit "darker" sounding but i love those with my mark 3.
Its not so Trebly sounding and you can use your presence without any mods

 

[sevenchaos]

Just a head's up: you might need to be aware of the tubes you run in the Class A sockets. I know with the C+ and a 105 tranny, only Mesa Reds are suitable for those sockets. .

???
Why's that?
All mesa tubes are bought from another factory, mesa dont do their tubes.
At this moment there are like 3 factorys left that make's tubes. EH's , Tungsol's , Sovtek's , Svetlanas comes from same factory
I know that mesa uses sovtek tubes and then they put their own logo there and "burn" them in with their own machines and mark the values of each tube.
I have been doing those things too, when i worked in small tube amp's repair shop we had big tube testers and "burn" in machines in there, so we were able to do same things that mesa does but with every tube we wanted. Mostly we measured and matched svetlana's winged c's and jj tubes, cuz they are most selling tubes

If you mean't that using 6l6's or el34's then your right :lol:

 

[JOEY B.]

Just a head's up: you might need to be aware of the tubes you run in the Class A sockets. I know with the C+ and a 105 tranny, only Mesa Reds are suitable for those sockets. .

???
Why's that?

If you mean't that using 6l6's or el34's then your right :lol:

Read this thread. http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=16487&start=0&hilit=color

 

[sevenchaos]

Read this thread. http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=16487&start=0&hilit=color

What i read from there red's have draw apr. 44mA. so you should be safe in range between 41-47mA.
So if you have someone to test your tubes you can ask him that you need tubes witch draw is in range of that.
No problem.

And thanks, that was quite good topic cuz i haven't measured my mark iii's voltages and calculated optical bias values but that gives some clue on that :lol:
I have just builded my own "bias-rite" sockets so i think that i'll should hit those to my green stripe and measure plate voltages. etc. Then I can ask that my friend measures from his stock tubes that have exact values for the bias.

 

[SonicProvocateur]

Thanks, flattery will get you everywhere!
Yeah, I've run just about every color in the outer sockets, they're not picky.

Lol

I also have the luxury (maybe not luxury?) of a 60 watter, so my saturation levels are slightly different (aggressive perhaps). My next amp will likely be a simul though.

I agree the 440 is closer to the 415 than the 430 is, but I think the =C= is closer yet.

Definitely with all the "hype" (I use the term loosely, everyone seems to love them), those will be my next investment. Along with some regular 6L6EH's just to A/B. I think one of my 415s may be trying to take a dump. :x Good thing I have a quad! 8) You can never have enough tubes for studio or touring spares!

 

[SonicProvocateur]

[
At this moment there are like 3 factorys left that make's tubes. EH's , Tungsol's , Sovtek's , Svetlanas comes from same factory

Ah, New Sensor Corp is the same Manufacture but not the same plant/workers/tooling machines.

Quality of product varies between any product that is made from partial machine and partial hand make. Thusly the SED =C= machines and Electroharmonix toolings are in current best for quality control, though it has waxed and waned in the past. Svetlana (who owns SED) has not always been known for awesome quality control and Sovtek was known more for Military grade products.

On tubedepot.com they have a tour of the SED factory here. You can see that quality control is very high versus more machine oriented welding and wiring.
http://www.tubedepot.com/sed1.html

 

[sevenchaos]

[
At this moment there are like 3 factorys left that make's tubes. EH's , Tungsol's , Sovtek's , Svetlanas comes from same factory

Ah, New Sensor Corp is the same Manufacture but not the same plant/workers/tooling machines.

Quality of product varies between any product that is made from partial machine and partial hand make. Thusly the SED =C= machines and Electroharmonix toolings are in current best for quality control, though it has waxed and waned in the past. Svetlana (who owns SED) has not always been known for awesome quality control and Sovtek was known more for Military grade products.

On tubedepot.com they have a tour of the SED factory here. You can see that quality control is very high versus more machine oriented welding and wiring.
http://www.tubedepot.com/sed1.html

Yeap.
I know that.
I have actually visited in there :lol:

 

[herrball]

Thanks for all the input guys. I'll probably pick up some EH 6L6s after the holidays calm down. They seem reasonably priced and should sound good.